An art forger and he said, you know what, if they think my art is as good as the real thing and, believe me, it is, then, you know what . They dont deserve the real thing. You start listening to them and you say, there is something to your logic. Rose spacey and konnikova, when we continue. Funding for charlie rose is provided by the following rose additional funding provided by and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and Information Services worldwide. Captioning sponsored by Rose Communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. Rose kevin spacey is here. He is a twotime oscar winning actor and star of the Ground BreakingNetflix Series house of cards that premiers on march 4. Heres a look. You have no idea what it means to have nothing. You dont value what we have achieved. I have had to fight for everything my entire life i saw a future. Our future. We had a future until you started destroying it. Rose it was announced in january that spacey will become the new chairman of relativity studios. This week he launched an online acting course at master class. Com. Next month cnn will premiere a new mini series race for the white house, executive, provided and narrated by guess who, kevin spacey. I am pleased to have him back at this table. With such a busy schedule, were lucky to have him. What is it about Frank Underwood . Why do you like him and we find him fascinating . Is it evil incarnate . It seems to me we could go back a long ways and say we have been fascinated by political figures, by royalty. You just think about shakespeare, and obviously Frank Underwood was born out of shakespeare. He was based when the book was written, he was based on richard iii and to some degree diegoer. Not macbeth, because macbeth hesitated. Rose frank does not hesitate. If you ignore the murdering and the conniving, she a politician that gets things done, and i think there is something to that in itself as to why people have really been attracted to the show, not just if the United States but around the world. Rose do you think that the image of that is part of reason that donald trump seems attractive to so many people he appears to be willing to say anything, do anything and get things done if you buy into his own sense of who he is . Well, theres no doubt that he seems to have burrowed into an angry public. Rose but looking for someone i guess just looking for someone who does it differently. So i suppose there is an interesting similar later there. Apparently, im told this is true, that there are a great number of people in china who believe that i actually am the president of the United States. Rose im told they love house of cards in china. Yes, they do. Rose and that the leadership there, not a particular person but members of the elite most of all. Yeah. Rose and they of it as this is america. Yes, and there is also another interesting side bar to that, which is that, apparently, the elites and all that, people in government, youre right, but for the common man, Frank Underwood is viewed as a man fighting against corruption, and hes become something of an heroic figure as a result of that. Rose lets talk more about him and whats going to happen this time. Shes out of the house. We get that from the promo. Theyre split. We meet them as we left them in season 3, having a little bit of an argument. Rose yes. And, look, the thing that we have been loving exploring and continued to do so this now Fourth Season and weve got some terrific actors that have joined the cast, alan burston, cicely tyson. Rose campbell. Yeah. And were going to continue to explore what happens when two people are in the middle of a campaign and they have this marital strife and how do they deal with it and, you know, will they ultimately decide they are better off together . Are they stronger or are they better off apart . Rose is that one of the questions being asked by season 4 of house of cards, are they better off together or apart . Sure. Rose whos the toughest, her or him . I think she is formidable and he would be nothing without her. Rose really . What does she give him . Everything. Also, i think she gives him balance in lots of ways that he couldnt find on his own. You know, if you want to call it the classic story behind well, i dont know if i want to call him a great man because there are people who think hes more moccovillian than that, but this remarkable woman and i think robins extraordinary portrayal will continue to grow and fascinate and continue to confound people as it goes forward. Rose do you want us to think hillary and bill. A lot of people say that must be because hes southern, but actually he sounds nothing like clinton. Rose how does clinton sound . speaking like bill clinton. you know how he sounds, has he ever been here . laughter no, the original francis in the british series was based on shakespearean characters. Rose richard iii. And bill willimon decided to make his hometown in South Carolina because thats where beaus father is from and in the first couple of months as we were preparing and he was writing those first two scripts, he called his dad one night and asked his father to read a direct address over the phone to him and then beau called me after that and said i think its going to with South Carolina where hes going to be from. Rose but of all the shakespearean characters youve played, which one has influenced you the more . Which one did you most find resonance . Well, the the truth is i havent played that many. Rose is that right . Yeah. Other than high school and scenes, the only shakespeare plays ive done are richard ii and iii. Rose i thought you had done many more. No, i havent. Rose how could you be the actor you are and never be tempt bid him . Fake it till you bake it, baby. laughter i mean, its not that i havent been tempted, i suppose rose fake it till you bake it . Or make it. One of the sayings. Rose yes. But im serious, heres a guy who left hollywood at the top of his game and went to run the old bick theater, then found out he could run the old bick theater and schedule productions and appear in some of them. Heres the honest truth, you cant run a theater and take all the good parts. You have to give good parts to other actors. So i took a role or two a year, but i didnt just want to do the classics, i wanted to do more diverse things because i was trying to build an audience. Rose do you like checov better than shakespeare . Im not an actor who covets parts. Im more excited when a director i want to work with says i want you to play this part. Rose you care about teaching actors and give them a chance and furthering their careers. It happened to me. Im a product of a School System where the arts were very well funded, where the experiences that i got as a young kid at nine, ten, eleven, 12, all the way to 18 years old was engaging and incredible and a chance to see professional actors do their works and do workshops with them and seminars and festivals, and, so, i know what it means, particularly for that shy kid in the corner, because when im doing workshops, which is why i was pleased that we were able to film master class because i have been doing these kind of workshops for 20 years but ive never allowed one to be filmed, and tucker carlsen, one of the directors in house of cards, came and direct it. We had 20 actors, we shot at the arena, and its really an extraordinary experience to allow an actor to do a monologue, they can do whatever they want. Rose how does the master class work . Essentially, i spent over two days. We shot about eight hours with these 20 actors. We did both individual work with their monologues, which i critique and ten give them direction and they try to go in a new way or i try push them in a new way. We then worked with masks, which were these incredible masks you put on your face and they change the way that you see yourself. In fact, you hopefully stop seeing yourself and work in front of a mirror. It loosens actors up. They stop thinking about their own bodies. And thats a technique to rye to get closer to the material, allow yourself to do things that you wouldnt normally feel comfortable doing if you were just looking at yourself in the mirror. We did, as i say, about eight hours of work with these actors, then i sat and did a oneonone interview, and cut it up into about 25 chapters and they run 10, 15, 20 minutes long and people can buy the whole master class. Rose just go online . Yeah, go online. Serena williams did one about tennis, annie leibowitz, usher have done one. The idea is to get a library of people doing a master class about how they do what they do and trying to help others learn how to do it. Rose this is you giving notes to a young actor from master class. What did it feel like . Good lord. laughter i mean, you giving me the note to go, 90 , because i always i never want to do too much. You know, i never want to go there, but giving me permission to do that just it just it came, you know. It hurt. It hurt. Yeah. Yeah, and, you know, look, weve got to be willing to do that, you know. Weve got to be willing to let it hurt. You know, all this notion that acting is, you know, its yeah, its pretend and, yes, we enjoy it and, yes, we can have a good time with it, but, you know, if you want to land, you want to make an impact, you want them to remember you, then you have to let it hurt sometimes. Youve got to get there because thats all an audience ever wants is for you to open up your chest and show them you have a heart. Thats all we want. Thats all we ever want. And whether that heart is in comedy or whether that heart is in something quite powerful, whether that heart is in poetry, whether that heart is in shakespeare, a heart, a human being, not an affecttation, wonderful work. Whos next . Rose see, i think thats great. Yeah. Rose i dont think you could do that without a passion about your own profession. Yeah, and also, look, these kids were fantastic. They prepared. They were open, they were willing to shift things and change things, and the most funny aspect of it to me was there i found myself over these two days giving direction to someone, saying something, and as it came out of my mouth, whatever i was saying there were at least 12 times this happened in the course of these two days, where i thought to myself, wow, that is a note that i really need to hear myself. That is something that i have not been doing. That is something that i have forsaken for a while. Boy, thats an important note. And i just say that to illustrate that. Rose i do, too. We are always in the process of learning and growing. Ill just tell you a story about a workshop i did in the middle east. I was encouraged to come to dohar and do a workshop in dohar. As i got closer and closer to going to the workshop, and ive done a whole number of these in the middle east, its a fascinating experience, as i got closer and closer to doing it, the organizers are saying, the registrations are going very well but just dont expect any women. I go, why . Well, its really not expected of women and its not what they you know, medicine and lawyer, these are the professions women are really expected to go into so just dont expect women. So i arrive in dohar and walk into the room and out of 28, there is 13 women. So i did that workshop and it was very engaging and very interesting. I was then asked would i do a workshop in abu dhabi and i said under one condition, the entire workshop has to be women. So we had two groups in abu dhabi. People prepared shakespeare, they were doing it in arabic and english. It was this fascinating experience. I spotted this one young girl in the corner who i could tell, you know, i recognized the shy one because that was me when i was a kid, and she was sort of looking down and occasionally wanted to look up. Erfriend had gotten up next to her and performed. We took a break, came back and i said, who wants to get up now, how about you . She went and i said, why not . She said, i dont know any shakespeare. I said, wel well, it could be anything. She went, well, i was told it had to be shakespeare. I said, no. Do you know Something Else . Do you know anything . She said, well, i might know something from fried green tomatoes. And i thought. Im in abu dhabi of all places and this young girl knows something from fried green tomatoes. So i said, of course. She gets up and performs this piece for us. And it was pe she was quite sels but i was listening to the content and it was very powerful. And i sat her down and i said, can you tell all of us what is the central problem this woman is going through . What is she experiencing . She began to describe a woman in an abusive relationship with a man and she was afraid he was going to begin to beat their child. I said, okay, i want you to do it again. Dont worry about us and dont worry about performing it. Just sit where you are, do it very simply. Connect to the emotions as best you can and share with us your feelings, share your feelings. So we all sat back and she started it again. Then about midway through, you can see when this thing happens to people, when the nickel drops, when something connects them to the material. And she had a line of dialogue she had only said once the first time she did it, but this time she hit her fist and said, and when he beat he, i thought of god, and when he beat me, i thought of god, and tears flew out of her eyes. I felt the whole room go like this. And she was suddenly connected, remarkable, and in a kind of effortless way, and she finished. And i stayed where i was and i said, now, that was beautiful work. We could all tell you why that was different for us. Can you tell us why it was different for you . And she said something that just illume illuminated the whole problem. She said, when you asked me to share my feelings, this is not something im ever asked. And i have been trying, and we did a big event in charza last year where we brought together 25 young middle eastern actors to do a play, and im trying to encourage the leaders there that whats frustrating about seeing them spend all this money eaters and these showcases and these fabulous, beautiful buildings to their arts is that, when all they do is cirque du soleil, they dont do workshops teaching the young people who want to be actors and tell stories about their own culture. So weve created something called homegrown which is a project we did in sharza last year and i want to continue to do more of that because i got a letter about six months after that workshop and that young girl is now trying to move to london to study to be an actress. Rose wow. And thats one of the reasons, no matter what happens to me in my life and all the sort of outward success that happens, i dont want ever to be too far away from that feeling because im one of those kids and i know, you know, what it meant to me when i was 13 years old and jack lemmon put his hand on my shoulder and said, you know, youre a born actor, you should go to new york and do this. Rose how influential was he . Huge. Rose is that the friendship . Well, later on having met him and being able to work with him professionally a number of ways. Rose but he put his hand on your shoulder and said youre a natural actor, you should go to new york and study, you were born to do this. I was 13 years old and i did go to new york and study and it has become my career. And whenever i find myself in these extraordinary circumstances where i see somebody who so clearly has talent and so clearly, if theyre nurtured, if theyre encouraged, if theyre guided in some way, they will have a remarkable career ahead of them. Rose does this ever occur to you, this thought, you do so many things, you do the master class and the classes you do in abu dhabi and everywhere else, you ran the old bick, youre getting ready to run a studio, you have so many interests, does that in any way limit the possibility of kevins growth as a great actor . Its a great question. I can only tell you that i believe, i think that when i left america in 2003 to go run the old vick, part of what was driving me to do it was that i wanted to be a better actor. You know, as much as one tries to keep sort of all the craziness, you know, and get pulled in all directions when success happens, and one of the reasons i left was because i didnt want to end up doing a lot of movies i probably shouldnt do for money and prestige and stay on these lists and be that guy and all that stuff you see happen when people reach a certain level, but im absolutely convinced that i did a play or two plays every year for the last 12 years, and working with trevor nun or working with Howard Davies or matthew and doing the parts i took on and doing runs that were 12 weeks, 14 weeks, 16 weeks, 8 weeks, 7 weeks, night after night after night in performance with richard iii and sam mendes around the world for ten months, i know rose you were stretching. Well, and im absolutely convinced that if i had not done all of that work, i would never have been ready to play Frank Underwood. There is no way that, 12 years ago, i would have known what to do. Rose what did that give you, do you know . Other than simply a sense of your own power. No, its more like this rose i mean power in terms of understanding your talents. No, well, ill explain it to you this way if youre a sports if youre an athlete you know, in workshops, i ask this question often and its amazing the answer, i say, how many times in the last two months have you d sometimes the answer will be, well, i had three auditions. And i said, thats not the question i asked. How many in the last two months have you acted . Sometimes they will go, i had three auditions. I go, lets break that down a second. Youre saying to me this craft that you have dedicated your life to, that youve sat her and told me has meant more to you than anything youve ever been a part of since you were in junior high school, that this craft you only practice when you have an audition . How many times do you think andy murray plays tennis . When he only has a championship to play . No, he practices every sing day single day, that is what doing plays is. Its not saying i did that performance last night. Its getting up every night and youre working on your game and your partners are changing and growing and i absolutely believe the act of being watched changes the game, and thats true for sports stars as it is you know, sports stars will talk about game day versus practice, and thats very different. Thats very true with actors. Rehearsal is nothing like the first or third preview. Rose yeah, but i would argue, too, and im not sure youre saying anything thats different than this, it is that what practice is about is giving you the capacity to be on that field and act primarily by instinct so that what you do is practice, practice, practice, so that you can meet as a tennis player does for practice any occu