Transcripts For MSNBC All In With Chris Hayes 20130822 : vim

Stay tuned for that. But we begin with incredible, shocking enthuse out of syria. A possible chemical weapons massacre with the government of president Bashar Al Assad with casualties from 100 to more than 1,200. The latter figure if confirmed would amount to one of the greatest war crimes of the past several decades. Nbc news cannot verify the authenticity of the amateur video we are about to show you. It purports to show victims of the attacks and contains images of injured adults and children that may be considered disturbing. Reporter this morning Syrian Rebels tell us there was a series of what they claim were chemical weapons attacks. Ten villages at least it to the east and north of damascus hit by what rebels say were surface to surface missiles fired by the regime and tipped with chemical weapons. The death toll well over 1,000. Symptoms before death, witnesses tell us, were shortness of breath, constricted pupils, foaming at the mouth. Weve seen videos posted online showing many women and children among the dead. The Syrian Government has denied categorically that it was responsible for this attack, denied that it used chemical weapons. That was nbc news chief Foreign Correspondent Richard Engel reporting, who will join us in a moment. It should be noted that the syrian observatory for human rights, which operates out of britain but employs a number of contacts inside syria, so far confirms 136 deaths as a result of this mornings attacks. It stands as the most violent military assault of that particular area since the beginning of the uprising. As we continue to show you this amateur video, it should be note that had much of it we choose not to show because it contains uncovered bodies, many of them children. But this still photo captures a sliver of the horror, syrian citizens trying to identify the dead bodies of children in damascus. Weve blurred the faces in this picture. More amateur video captures smoke rising in the aftermath of the bombings. Meanwhile, the stance of the major powers in regard to this conflict seems largely unchanged. The russian government accuses the rebels of unleashing the attack themselves, the pretext for incurring favor. The United States should facilitate the team of the u. N. Inspectors. Suffice it to say, though, that the use of chemical weapons is something the United States finds totally deplorable and completely unacceptable. And those who are responsible for the use of chemical weapons, if its determined thats what happened, will be held accountable. A United Nations chemical Investigations Team arrived in syria just days ago, part of the 14day mission to investigate claims of chemical weapons in other prior attacks. And today the u. N. Security council today held an emergency meeting. All this, all of this, amid a whirlwind of news out of egypt already in a state of tremendous tumult with Hosni Mubarak set to be released from prison ahead of a retrial, there are worries about further violence in a country that, of course, has seen recent crackdowns against promorsi rebels and awful reprisals against Egyptian Police and christian civilians in places of worship. Joining me now is nbc news chief Foreign Correspondent Richard Engel. Richard, what do we know . What can be confirmed about the awful, awful, awful images we are seeing out of syria today . Reporter weve spoken to medical personnel. Weve spoken to syrian activists in these areas where the attacks allegedly took place. Clearly something happened. They believe it was a chemical gas attack that around 2 30 in the morning there began a barrage of surface to surface rockets first firing into the Eastern Suburbs just outside of damascus. That lasted for about an hour with apartment buildings being hit. Initially people thought that it was just more of the standard shelling that is very common place in the war in syria as weve been seeing it. Then casualties started showing up in the field hospitals, people started talking about chemical weapons attacks. Then the casualties started flooding in. Civilians, women, children, people who had been in those apartment buildings. After about an hour, the attacks shifted to the north, northern suburbs just outside of damascus, and a very similar pattern unfolding in those same areas. We dont exactly know the death toll. They range from hundreds to well over 1,000. But the kinds of stories, the kind of injuries, the kind of deaths that were suffered are fairly consistent in the videos. We cant authenticate the videos because they were posted independently by people who are supporting the revolution in syria, but they seem quite they seem very difficult to fake. Weve also shown them to independent experts, chemical weapons experts, who thought they were consistent with a nonconventional weapons attack. So what does this mean . The president has talked about a red line and has been careful in discussing a red line to talk about mass casualty events, to talk about systemic deployment. If we are seeing Something Like this, if it is confirmed, it seems to me is the most systemic mass attack, deployment of chemical weapons. What does that mean for the red line the president has noted . Reporter this would be a totally different scale of events. In the past weve talked about chemical weapons being used to kill one, two, five people in numerous attacks. That always struck observers as a bit strange, more of a terror tactic than a tactic of war. Using a limited amount of chemical weapon to scare your enemy instead of creating mass casualties. If this, in fact, is confirmed, this would be a different kind of attack. Some of the rebels were talking about well over 1,000 killed. As you mentioned in your intro, if thats confirmed its one of the worst war crimes, one of the worst atrocities carried out in decades. The president talked about having a red line. If this is confirmed not only is it crossed, that red line has been jumped over. Nbc news chief Foreign Correspondent Richard Engel, thank you. Joining me now is author, journalist and msnbc contributor rula jebreal. Youve spent some time with the rebels. You and i have both been, i think its fair to say, skeptical of the efficacy of u. S. Interjection. This is more than a red line. Richard engel is right. This is a moment we need to show the regime that something will be done if he will continue. If he used these weapons he has to be held accountable. He has to give the u. N. Access to all of these sites. Who knows who can access these sites further. If its a paled state, you can have anybody and we are skeptical because theres within the Free Syrian Army there is an element that is very islamist. What if there are these sites who have access to these sites are this kind of islamists. We need to intervene more now than ever. Here is where i watch this and i think two things, what we see today, again, if confirmed we have to say we cannot verify the video but it does these circumstantial picture certainly looks like something truly horrific. It looks like iraq. It looks like Saddam Hussein did in iraq to the kurds. Lets remember, enter the iranians when theres a civil war between iran and iraq, Saddam Hussein used chemical weapons and these are similar image to what we see coming from iraq from the kurdish area and from the iranian area. This is the incident in 1980 in which Saddam Hussein used chemical agents against the kurds. Exactly. Now, you know, hes gaining in the battlefield hes gaining ground. Assad . Sorry, assad. And his allies in the region are helping him. Iran, hezbollah, and hes looking at egypt and hes thinking, you know what, they toppled the president. We had islamists winning. It didnt succeed and now back to the old regime. Even mubarak is coming by. You think assad is making the calculation he looks at the regional picture saying actually this arab spring, this wave of revolution, were now seeing retrenchment, i can hold on to this. I can stick this out. Exactly. Also he sees confusion by the west. We werent able to call a coup a real coup for days until now were not even cutting the aid from the egyptians after they killed thousands of protesters. Look, assad is the most machiavellian dictator in the region and hes looking around him and hes making a very hard calculation saying, okay, i tested the chemical weapons. Nobody protested. Now im testing it in a bigger scale. So lets say that is the case. Lets say those initial reports which were very small scale and baffling in their deployment we now see something, again, if confirmed, a mass attack, a war crime. A war crime. What is the response . You and i have talked about the dangers and the rebels, the fractious situation on the ground there, about the al qaeda affiliate elements that are part of the rebel group the Free Syrian Army, we talked about the possibility of blow back, the difficulty of control. So what does any kind of escalating u. S. Intervention or accountability or punishment for crossing the red line look like . Look, we have to think about it this way. What is the least worst option that we have today . To leave the situation like this, this is not an option. The real option today is really to push and not to leave before things are fixed, to push on the international community, convince the russians. The russians will not stand up to this. The israelis will not stand up to this. Before we intervene, they may try to intervene themselves because this is, you know, threatening their areas, threatening the Golan Heights and other areas. And theres already communication between the rebels and the israelis. The thing i worry about the most is, is the idea that there is a sequence of testing here, about how far and what he can get away with and if this is allowed. At the same time i just it is an absolute no good options situation. No, look, if assad will leave, we know from now that this war will carry on for maybe for many years. Lets put it this way. We know that there will be retaliation. There will be a failed state and there will be an islamist element within it, but we have to understand that theres no solution until the syrians, all of them, write a social contract where everybody is included, minorities especially, women, kurds, everybody inside. That has to be done now before we enter the region. We are very, very far from that. Msnbc contributor rula jebreal. Thank you for having me. Republicans wont give up on trying to get rid of obama care. [ male announcer ] these days, a Small Business can save by sharing. Like carpools. Polly wants to know if we can pick her up. Yeah, we can make room. Yeah. [ male announcer ]. Office space. Yes, were loving this communal seating. Its great. [ male announcer ] the best thing to share . A data plan. At t mobile share for business. One bucket of data for everyone on the plan, unlimited talk and text on smart phones. Now, everyones in the spirit of sharing. Hey, can i borrow your boat this weekend . No. [ male announcer ] share more. Save more. At t mobile share for business. I understand that my actions violated a law and i regret if my actions hurt anyone or harmed the United States. When i chose to disclose classified information, i did so out of a love for my country and a sense of duty to others. If you deny my request for a pardon, i will serve my time knowing that sometimes you have to pay a heavy price to live in a free society. Those are the words of private Bradley Manning today after he was sentenced to 35 years in prison for leaking hundreds of thousands of classified u. S. Documents. Hell be eligible for parole in seven years. His sentence is exactly 11 years longer than the sentence for Army Specialist Jeremy Warlock who pled guilty in 2007 to three counts of premeditated murder after he admitted to taking part in the killing of three afghan civilians for sport. Bradley manning will, in all likelihood, do more time for leaking documents. He renewal notice. By about 110 a month. Roll the dice. Care act was passed, company to go down by about 60 a month. Little guy rebecca the law works. Jamie to checkout. He there are lots of jamies out there, but that doesnt mean were all the same. Just like greek yogurts. Thats why i prefer activia greek. Mmm activia helps regulate your digestive system. Activia greek, activia like no other greek yogurt. Dannon when it comes to obama care it seems there is no amount of encouraging or even downright good news about the law that will pop the bubble of rage, discontent and rooting for failure on the right. Yesterday House Speaker john boehner said republicans are, quote, looking at all options to reach our ultimate goal of repealing this law that is causing premiums to soar. Thats the leader of the Republican Party saying republicans want to repeal it because Health Care Premiums are soaring. This week we found out that is not true. In fact, quite the opposite. According to a survey released yesterday by the Kaiser Family foundation, the average annual premium for a family of four rose 4 in 2013. Now that 4 is still a lot. Still more than the 1. 8 increase in wages and the 1. 1 rate of inflation, but it is also historically speaking a very small increase, way lower than growth in the late 1990s and early 2000s. In other words, the trend of premiums is they are doing the opposite of soaring. They are landing. So far republicans are not letting that interrupt their war against the law and something tells me they wont let a new report from usa today get in the way either. The report found that estimates from the 19 states operating Health Exchanges for the uninsured show that at least 8. 5 Million People will use the exchanges to buy insurance. A number that would far outstrip the federal governments estimate of 7 million new customers for all 5 states under the 2010 health care law. Health exchanges for the uninsured are actually working. Republicans are not interested. Last night we actually did see something out of the ordinary. A little dose of reality injected into the world of ted cruze and the defund obama Care Campaign when a woman in the crowd asked him a pointed question. Hold on. Maam, feel free to speak. I recently lost my health coverage. Has anyone else in this room i had to go to mexico to get my diabetic medication because i could not afford it in the states. I just want to know what you are going to do to take care of the 6 Million People who cant afford health care. We can take care of ourselves. As it turns out not every republican is impervious to the basic reality of what the president S Health Care law does and could do. Clint murphy, a 30yearold man, has spent much of his life working in the Republican Party. At one point working for the National Republican congressional committee, the bush administration, and even running a campaign against barack obama with john mccain in 2008. But today, after surviving testicular cancer and years of battling Insurance Companies over preexisting condition, hes seen the light and now supports the president S Health Care law. At this moment he does not have Health Insurance and so clint murphy joins me right now. What was the moment hi, chris. Hi, clint. What was the moment when you changed your mind on this . I mean, it was an evolving process. Definitely not you know, in 2010, i figured after ten years i should be good to get Health Insurance on the individual market and was turned down again. This time instead of it being cancer it ended up being the i was taking a drug for anxiety. They cited that as a preexisting condition and sleep apnea as a preexisting condition and i was straight up denied by two different companies. So obviously thats exactly the kind of denial that would be outlawed under the new Affordable Care act that is outlawed under the Affordable Care act. For people that are watching this and saying, okay, i see what happens, this guy, when it happens to him, decides the law is good but why cant he and his fellow republicans just have a little bit of empathetic imagination, extend out the barriers of their thinking a little bit to imagine their fellow citizens finding themselves in a similar situation . Yeah, and i think thats a fair question to ask. Since i was diagnosed in 2000 ive fought every day a part of my life to help improve those who survive cancer, to help fund a cure and see an end to cancer in our lifetime. As we started going into the 2008 race, i was really optimistic about the dialogue that was taking place and after the president was elected the spirit of bipartisanship quickly faded away and everyone retreated to their corners. Okay. What do you think when you watch this many years on when you watch republicans wanting to defund the law, wanting to get rid of a law that has given people coverage, that would actually take coverage away from people, would take coverage away from you . What do you think about that . Its gotten to the point where its something that i cannot support and will not support anybody with that position. Were talking about something that affects my life and affects a lot of the people that i love and care about. And its not right. Its not fair and its pure blind partisanship that is drawing this rain of thought. At the risk of destroying this country it seems like the Repu