At some Point Washington has to deal with its spending problem. And when your dad says something, you listen. And when you dont, it usually bites you in the [ bleep ] later on. Ive had enough of it. Its time to act. The clock is now ticking on what many economists say is a nearcertain double dip recession if more than a trillion dollars in automatic spending and defense cuts are allowed to occur at the beginning of next month. And while the president is busy running the government, today nominating a new candidate for the interior department. And yesterday pleading for action to prevent the socalled sequester, republicans have been out front telling anyone who will listen that they, too, are absolutely opposed to any cuts to military and discretionary spending. I dont like the sequester. I think its taking a meat ax to our government. A meat ax to many programs, and it will weaken our national defense. However, just to be clear, Speaker Boehner says that he will not allow any new revenues to prevent the ax from falling. And hes not alone. Congressman tom cole of oklahoma says we just had additional revenue for the federal government, so i dont see any way in the world the sequester wont happen. Not to be outdone, tom rooney of florida says it seems that a large portion of our conference is resigned to the fact that sequestration is okay. What . Our conference is resigned to the fact that sequestration is okay . Its not. Its dangerous. Its a huge mistake. A threat to our liberty. A threat to our liberty . Not every republican is willing to show mr. Rooneys candor. But if and when the sequester does happen, remember, its all the president s fault. Many of your colleagues are saying okay. Then theres no deal. Let those cut gos through. Right. Sequester is here. Its up to the president to come forward with serious cantor, the president has presented a serious plan. Not the one you want, but its the only one until you Party Decides whether its for or against the sequester. I believe that they should at least pass a smaller package of spending cuts and tax reforms that would delay the economically damaging effects of the sequester for a few more months until Congress Finds a way to replace these cuts with a smarter solution. And cue the hapless Speaker Boehner and his kick the can routine. Washington has to deal with its spending problem. Ive watched them kick this can down the road for the 22 years ive been here. Ive had enough of it. Its time to act. Yes, sir. Lets get to our panel now. Dana milbank for the Washington Post and senior fellow at the center on budget and priorities. Good day to you both. Jared, lets talk about this report that came out tuesday which says that if these trilliondollar sequester cuts occur, then theyll cut gdp growth in half. Right. Tell me this, jared. Why are republicans so nonplus about this. And why not look at spain or italy or britain for the evidence . Where economists are now predicting a tripledip recession. All because they applied the paul ryan budget in those countries. Thats what they did. Well, the word you used there, evidence, is anatima to these folks. If you looked around, you would conclude the best way to take a fragile recovery and turn it into a recession is to whack away at government spending. The private sector is still climbing back. And therefore, we need a robust government sector to compliment that. And thats what the cbo its one of the things the cbo said yesterday. What they said was absent the sequestration which by the way is 85 billion in 2013. Not to mention other Things Congress has done. Including taking the payroll tax cut out of the economy. Thats over a hundred billion right there. Cutting the gdp growth in half. It would be closer to 3 . Instead, its closer to 1. 5 . If gdp is growing at 1. 5 , the Unemployment Rate wont go down. It will slowly tick up. Indeed it will. Dana, no gdp report is all good or all bad. In this report, there are good points. For instance, deficits are decreasing. However, all i ever hear from republicans is the president needs to get serious. From speaker john boehner. Thats the best impersonation i can give you. Its not bad. Wasnt very good, nothing personal. But dana, is that it . Well, that was a little raspy, your john boehner. But i think youve captured the sentiment, more or less correctly. And yes, the cbo report shows that the deficit is shrinking. But it is also showing the efforts to shrink the deficit have taken away from growth and the economy. You cant have one of these things without the other. Now, i think theres a fallacy in the first question you posed to jared. That is that republicans would be very upset if there were a doubledip recession in a political sense as Rush Limbaugh and others have stated, they may be in a stronger position if the economy goes back into recession. Then the president and his Majority Party will be less powerful. So they actually have a political incentive. Hang on a second, dana. Youre saying something thats troublingly close to the idea that they spent the first four years undermining this president and obstructing him in the hope that the economy wouldnt work for him at the election. Now youre implying theyre happy to destroy the economy for his second term. That is exactly what im saying. So youre saying that republican politicians are happy to tank the economy, push us into a recession for the benefit of their own political purposes. I dont know if id say theyre happy to, martin. Their constituents are going to suffer as well. But when you dom one of these deadlines like were going to have at the end of the month, they have a little bit less of an incentive to blink here. That may have the rosy effect of bringing down the numbers for the president and the democrats. Jared . Heres the thing. I dont think the economy is going to go into recession if we have the sequester. If whats going on here is a level of growth is positive but too slow to bring the Unemployment Rate down, to give people the kind of jobs and earnings opportunities they need. The problem with the economy is we have been stuck in this slog for way too long. Right. And im of the mind set that if we actually leave the economy alone, id love to see infrastructure investment, for example. Thats not going to happen. If we just stop selfinflicting wounds, i think theres enough underlying fundamental recovery that slowly, too slowly in any estimation, but slowly we would get better. This is not let me say. This is not the difference between recession and no recession. Its the difference between actual growth we could benefit from and continued slog. But, jared, heres the problem. We talk about cuts to the military. But these cuts could hit localities hard. Absolutely. Philadelphia has warned of the possibility of fewer Police Officers on the streets. Then of course the disaster that awaits the poor. Does it really make sense for republicans, jared, to stand for protecting tax breaks for Oil Companies while slashing Education Training and the number of Police Officers in philadelphia . Not only does it not make sense to republicans, but republicans seem to be starting to see into it that its not the greatest idea at least to run on this idea will take the economy. Now theyre stuck between the budget that does exactly that and a public face that says dont worry, be happy. Hard to have a public face that says dont worry, be happy when your budget is all about getting rid of programs for the disadvantaged. This is the thing, dana. These are not theoretical concepts anymore. This is real. Jim miklaszewski says because of the sequester, the u. S. Navy has cut its patrolling the persian gulf. The persian gulf, i wonder how they feel about sequestration in iran. This is a very real thing. We had eric cantor yesterday giving a speech. He gave one line to the whole question of the fiscal situation. He says but we need to be about more than that. We have to be the happy party that talks about immigration, health care, job growth. All these other things. But then hes right back there talking about the sequester. And the party is unable to escape from that issue. If you can sigh what this is doing tho the United States military, you can infer its going to be worse if the republicans with their budget were able to get their way. Yeah. Jared, to that point, you know, the mythical paul ryan budget aside for the moment. That in 35 months, this nation has created six million jobs. The house price. It remains a fragile economy. You said earlier in this interview that you dont think that these sequesters will provoke a doubledip recession. But this isnt going to help where we are now, is it . Right. Thats exactly my point. I mean, what were talking about here if you think of the economy as sort of a bicycle, what you want to see is it moving enough so its not wobbly. If youre growing at 2. 5 to 3 which by the way cbo said yesterday growth could be 3 . But for all of this fiscal restrax weve been talking about now youre talking about 1. 5 . Thats a wobbly bicycle. Yes, instead of building on some of the smengsed. Job growth has done a little better than expected. Instead of building on that kind of momentum, were talking about yet another selfinflicted wound. I dont know how many times ive sat in the chair whether its debt ceiling, sequester. We have got to stop inflicting wounds on this economy. It is political malpractice. Indeed, it is. Jared bernstein and dana milbank, thank you so much. Thank you. Much more ahead, but first a lighter moment with the president as he announces his latest cabinet pick. When sallys confirmed, im willing to bet that she will be the first secretary of the interior who frequently hikes and once spent a month climbing mountains in antarctica which is not something id do. Because it seems like itd be cold. And i was born in hawaii. [ man ] ring ring. Progresso this reduced sodium soup says it may help lower cholesterol, how does it work . You just have to eat it as part of your heart healthy diet. Step 1. Eat the soup. All those veggies and beans, thats what may help lower your cholesterol and well thats easy [ male announcer ] progresso. You gotta taste this soup. [ babies crying ] surprise your house was built on an ancient burial ground. [ ghosts moaning ] surprise your car needs a new transmission. [ coyote howls ] how about no more surprises . Now you can get all the online Trading Tools you need without any surprise fees. Its not rocket science. Its just common sense. From td ameritrade. Big time taste should fit in a little time cup. New single serve cafe collections from Maxwell House now available for use in the keurig kcup brewer. Always good to the last drop. If we as a people dont act after sandy hook, then we as a people are broken. Doing nothing will fail. Doing nothing has failed. Im just here to support the president of the United States. Theres nothing quite so serious as a comedian who isnt laughing. And that was the scene in washington today as chris rock, tony bennett, and amanda pete joined democratic mayors and congressmen in calling for action to curb the pandemic of gun violence. In just the last 24 hours a woman and two children were shot and killed in denver this morning. In las vegas two men were hospitalized after being shot in the lobby of a movie theater. And in detroit one man is dead and another wounded after being shot near a house allegedly frequented by drug dealers. Joining us now is democratic strategist Julian Epstein and msnbc political analyst, professor michael dyson. Weve all had to witness the black humor of Wayne Lapierre over the last few weeks. But heres a black comedian on this. You dont need gun control. We need bullet control. We need to control the bullets. Thats right. I think all bullets should cost 5,000. 5,000. You know why . Because if it costs 5,000, thered be no more innocent bystanders. When even comedians and crooners like tony bennett are begging for action, are you becoming more optimistic that the nation is prepared now to do something substantive on this issue . Well, i am. Im hopeful at least. Optimism may be a shallow virtue fair compared to hope. But i think the evidence is growing in line with peoples sentiments across this nation who are simply fed up. We want common sense gun control. We want a president who uses his bul bully pulpit to talk about the disregard of common sense for those people who are promoting, you know, the loud and vigilant and aggressive no holds barred approach to guns. The nra has to be brought into line here. Most americans think we want to protect the second amendment. We dont want to undermine it, but at the same time we want to have common sense approaches here that allow people to say yes enough is enough. And when chris rock and tony bennett and amanda pete come together and forge a connection, think that sends a powerful message to the nation that yes, this message is getting a broad hearing and people should pay attention. Julian, to that point, while the nra says even background checks are not worth the time of day, take a look at what the public is saying. A new poll says that 39 of voters are less likely to support a candidate if theyre endorsed by the nra. Julian, are we weech reaching a Tipping Point in terms of the nra and its power and influence over politicians and the nation . We are reaching a Tipping Point. The politics have changed. The question is whether the people that want to do something can overcome the obstructionism by the republicans and the congress who are clearly going against the majority will here. And i just want to underscore a point i made the other day which is that i think right now even the o ent pos are conceding we could get background checks. They cant stop that. Because 90 of americans support that. But there is a merging amongst democrats, a path of least resistance wisdom that background checks are all that we can get. Thats unfortunate because background checks as important as they are, would not stop the massacre in newtown. They would not have stopped the massacre in aurora. They would probably not have stopped the massacre at virginia tech. The idea that we now with the numbers youre citing would begin to see the argument. That even though 50 to 60 of americans want action on clips and assault weapons, chris rock said we should be looking at other ways like taxing bullets and ammunition to stop the mayhem we have. 30,000 gun related homicides each year. The gun industry makes maybe a billion dollars in profits but Public Health professionals would tell you 30,000 homicides are costing this country stens of billions of dollars a year. This is a huge economic crisis as well. I think the fact the democrats would not be talking about ceding the ground. Publishes its list of most wanted enemies. If you havent seen it, its well worth taking a look. Heres a quick sample. First youve got Leonard Nimoy whose ears are suspiciously like the president s. Then youve got lou gossett jr. Then theres henry winkler. Can you tell me, is an organization like the nra on the right track when theyre more frightened of the fonz than of firearms . Its all messed up. It better be scared of lou gossett jr. And Leonard Nimoy, hes just out of this world. The reality is this. The nra is focusing on minutia. What jesus said in the bible, youre schoeking on the small stuff and swallowing whole hogs so to speak. The big stuff here. I think the nra has to come to its senses. Being obsessed with the list it puts out. The blacklist of the people who dont comport with them or go along with their values is nonsense. We are all americans. We are just upset with the way things are going. We are fed up with this. The billions of dollars made by the gun industry should be more than enough compensation for sacrificing just a little. Not of its rights but of its responsibility to make sure those who have the guns are acting responsibly and we dont have in the hands of criminals machinery and weaponry that will outmatch or overmatch the Police People who are hired to protect us. Why cant we get some sensible stuff on this . Because the gun lobby is so profoundly in control of its own agenda and it asserts it. I think julian is right. If the democrats cave in on this, its a tragedy and a shame. Because now is the time when the wind is behind them and beneath their wings that theyve got to have enough courage and chutzpah. Not everybody can be on the enemys list. If you look at who are behind the president. Its not just the celebrities. I wouldnt be surprised if youre on the enemies list. I believe i am. Id imagine. Its parents groups, most of the public behind it. At some point this enemies list is absurd. I think while its important as i said for democrats in the congress not just to focus on background checks but on the other things that are important, its also important that we see action can occur at the state and local level. We talked several weeks ago about taking action against irresponsible gun manufacturers. Consumers can take action on dealers like walmart and others. So theres lots of things that can be done here to change the politics. But i think your Central Point is that the politics on this thing, the tide is changing, the nra sand castles are quickly blowing out to sea. Julian epstein and professor michael eric dyson. Thank you, gentlemen. And we take you now to the ceremonial swearing in of john kerry. Moments ago Vice President joe biden administerered the oath saying he could think of no better man or woman for the job. Stay with us. Using Cloud Computing and mobile technology, verizon innovators have developed a projective display for firefighters. 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