Wall, paul. And the threats. Hes been terrific. Now if he ever goes against me, i wont say that, okay . When all in starts right now. Good evening from new york. Im chris hayes. In 37 days donald trump will become president of these United States. We have breaking news tonight. Two Senior Intelligence officials tell nbc news that russian president Vladimir Putin was involved in efforts to disrupt the u. S. President ial election. That conclusion is based on intelligence from diplomatic sources and others including spies working for americas allies. That comes on top of growing consensus in the Intelligence Community in the u. S. That russia was behind multiple large scale attacks on Democratic Institutions and operatives producing fodder for countless embarrassing and politically damaging stories at the height of the president ial election. The in the just had amazing reporting on the alleged scope of the russia Cyber Attacks which targeted the Democratic NationalCommittee Chairman podesta and also a dozen house candidates. Regardless of whether russia meant to help elect trump is still among dispute among different agency, his government
succeeded in influencing the outcome of the u. S. Election. President obama has ordered a fuel review of the role in the election. Theres now bipartisan support in the senate for some type of investigation. Joining me National Security reporter ken delany. And i guess my First Response to this story was how could they possibly know this . So it seems, you know, explosive to say that putin was personally supervising this, but this is two Intelligence Officials off the record. Theres some sort of grain of salt i always attach t anything, you know, anonymous from the Intelligence Community. How could they possibly know this . Thats certainly a fair question, chris. Thanks for having me, by the way. The short answer is we dont exactly know. But we know or were told that they are reviewing this information with high confidence. And were told its coming from
liaisons, from other intelligence sources, people presumably with access to putin or the russian regime. Thats all we know. So part of the story here is theres a forensic story about who did this and then theres a kind of whole chain, right, who did it, what was their connection to the russian state, how much were they how closely were they directed, there were some beginning theories that maybe this was just a Rogue Element or a bunch of people that got out over their skis and before you know it theyre inside the dnc. This is all sort of a settling this chain is the work that the intelligence apparatus is doing right now. Exactly. And were sort of looking through an opaque glass trying to figure out through bits and pieces of reporting what exactly they know. And what you describe as the forensic case, which a private firm initially made is that, hey, the malware and the hacks that were seeing into the Democratic National committee can be traced back to these russian entities. That doesnt tell us anything about who was in the russian
fairly general, but were told that he was involved in directing how to use the leaked material, which is fairly specific. That is fascinating. Ken dilanian. Im joined by ed mcmullen, a former cia operations officer. Theres a crazy subtext thats happening here in terms of the Intelligence Agencies and the cia. Donald trumps people seem to think that hes antidonald trump and they have it out for him. What do you say to their people who say that . Well, obviously, theres a natural conflict there. People at the cia understand what a threat Vladimir Putin are to Global Security and to the United States, to our security, to the integrity of our democratic system. And so theyre opposed to what donald trump is trying to impose upon our country, which is a relationship with the very country that is undermining our democracy. I have to say with regard to whether putin would have directed this or not, of course he knew about it and of course
its a big, big deal in the kremlin and theyre celebrating right now. Are you part of the problem, right, is ascertaining the confidence that all these links in the chain are there, right . And again, this is youre shaking your head. You just think its so obvious. Its just so look, i understand i come from this world so i understand how these things work and those of us in the Intelligence Community just know these things because weve seen them play out in other situations. We know that russia does this in europe all the time. This is not a new strategy or a new playbook. This is what russia does to undermine democracies in europe. Now theyre doing it in the United States. Its the russianbacked trolls, its the hacks, its the support for the white nationalist, white supremacist movement. Its finding a country in a
democratic country like ours that is sympathetic to the russian or the putin way of his authoritarianism and his White Nationalism and all of this and promoting them through these other means. I mean, its mr. Playbook. And they did it here in the United States, its clear. If this is the case, if this is what happened, what does this mean . It means that it means that, you know, our fragile democracy and it is fragile and we need to fight hard to keep it. Our founders knew that would be the case. I think were a little Asleep At The Wheel these days or have been as americans. It means that we as americans need to stand up and demand that our elected leaders in congress, and we must do the same, hold our system accountable, our elected representatives accountable and oppose Donald Trumps planned alignment with russia. Theres a reason why we have opposed russia on the global stage. Its not arbitrary. Russia is an adversary, the liberty, freedom and basic rights across the globe and here in the United States. And we have stood up to them with our partners, with our allies, our free allies in europe and its important that we continue to do that for the cause of liberty here and abroad. Do you think that the president of the United States should Say Something on the record about all this . Well, he has said some things and i think certainly at a time when he judges it to be the right time, he should. We need leadership in the country especially on this issue. I imagine that hes dealing with a lot of very sensitive considerations, very classified considerations that its hard for you and i sitting here to make a judgment about what he should say or shouldnt say. Certainly, we need leadership. Certainly the American People need information. Ill say that i think our electors they deserve to be
briefed on what they can be briefed on with regard to what russian has done in the election and in related ways since then. So they need all the information they can get so that they can perform their constitutional duties. Let me ask you this. You know, theres a statement, this sort of extraordinary statement. I dont think ive ever seen anything like it in the time ive been coveri politics. After the reporting had broken that basically late friday night that the cia had come to this conclusion that this was done and not just done to kind of create mischief but explicitly for this electoral outcome to beat Hillary Clinton and the President Elect put out a statement that says these are the people that got iraq wrong and i had this youre grimacing even at that statement. I mea you work for the cia. What is that relationship like now . The President Elect has called war on them, called them out. What is that going to be like . Its going to be a very troubled relationship. But the American People end up being the losers. Im not sure if donald trump had the information that the cia would give him or wants to give him, if that would make him make wise decisions. Im not sure it would. So i dont know. Maybe its a wash. But look, ill tell you, americans need to understand this. The cia gives advice to senior policymakers. The president , of course, included chief among them. And does a variety of assessments every day all day long. Hundreds of them. Thats the reality. And they deal in an uncertain world, the world we live in. And thats why we have them. We have them to connect the dots. Sometimes theyre not right. Most of the time they are. Because theyre very theyre very conscientious and conservative in the assessments they make most of the time. Now, people talk about mistakes that are made and times they were wrong, those are the times when things become well known, but assessments that they make every day tend to be correct. For a president to say i dont
want any of that, is just reckless and just plain stupid. Evan mcmullin. Much more ahead on this and other stuff. Knew today we also got big news from the man who will be running the security apparatus. Retired general Michael Flynn generosity is its own form of power. Get your mind out of the gutter. Mornings are for coffee and contemplation. That was a really profound observation. You got a mean case of the detox blues. Dont start a war you know youre going to lose. Finally you can now find all of netflix in the same place as all your other entertainment. On xfinity x1. Who donald trump has named as his National Security adviser. Thats not a position that requires Senate Confirmation unless Trump Rescinds the offer flynn will be his National Security whisperer in the white house. Todays news puts what flynn said on the campai trail and in the Republican National convention in a different light. When he called on Hillary Clinton to drop out of the race because she, quote, put our nations security at extremely high risk. Lock her up. Lock her up. [ Crowd Chanting lock her up. ] you guys are good. Damn right. Exactly right. Theres nothing wrong with that. [ Crowd Chanting lock her up ] and you know why . You know why were saying that . Were saying that because if i, a guy who knows this business, if i did a tenth, a tenth of what she did, i would be in jail today. This was, of course, the trump campaigns main attack on clinton, particularly in the campaigns final days, this idea that she belonged in jail because she used private email servers as Secretary Of State potentially compromising Classified Information and putting National Security at risk. Didnt matter. The fbi investigated the matter, concluded no charges should be filed. Trump threatened to jail her if elected. And those lock her up chants became a staple of the politics. The Washington Post reporting that Michael Flynn who again
helped lead those locker up chants was the subject of a secret u. S. Military information in 2010 that determined that flynn inappropriately shared Classified Information with Foreign Military officers in afghanistan. Flynn was not disciplined because investigators concluded he didnt act knowingly and ultimately didnt damage National Security. But of course, the fbi came to a not dissimilar determination about Hillary Clinton. And flynn, knowing what he knew, still called for her to be thrown in jail. We reached out today to the House Oversight and government reform chair Jason Chaffetz to see if he would investigate flynn for risking Classified Information as vigorously as he did clinton. We did not hear back. This is not the first red flag for flynn that has stated his views. He tweeted about clintons involvement in sex Crimes Involving children. Jeanne shaheen and richard
blumenthal have requested an official review of flynns Security Clearance citing todays report in a separate incident in which he disclosed information to pakistan and that he, and im quoting, had technicians secretly install an Internet Connection in his Pentagon Office even though it was forbidden. Hes become the main funnel for Security Information to a president who youll recall has been skipping his Intelligence Briefings because, as trump said, im like a smart person. Joining me now, michael steele, former chair of the republan national committee. The lock her up thing, i mean, its amazing the parallels, right . Yeah. So Hillary Clinton does this thing that violates protocol. Shes investigating. The finding is, yeah, she violated protocol but she didnt knowingly compromise National Security, shes okay. But the argument was that she knowingly violated that protocol right. And general flynn did the same thing. No. They said he did not know he had violated this protocol. And thats the difference. You think its perfectly fine that the onetenth rule here that he leads lock her up chants at the rnc for a woman who has been cleared by the fbi. Right. Who says even after being cleared by the fbi the political opponent should be put in prison despite the fact that he did this and he also had a secret Internet Connection installed in his Pentagon Office. Yeah, well, look, i cant speak to all of that in terms of what he did while he was in the office, but i can speak to the politics of being at a National Convention and getting in that firedup space and using that chant. We all know that that chant was not one of the best chants out there because it doesnt speak to who we are as americans. We dont lock people up as political prisoners, per se. Well, who knows, right . And were not. And were not. Come on, stop it. But michael, let me ask you this, if you had to bet after
election day that you would still hear lock her up after trump had won, at a rally in wisconsin, doesnt that surprise you . No, it doesnt. No, it doesnt. Because the carryover from this election goes beyond what weve seen in the past. The voters in this election cycle have been more fervent than weve seen in a generation in terms of their passion to make their decision stick. And they feel and to imprison their political enemies. No, i dont think theyre talking literally at this point. Donald trump himself has said thats not going to happen. Hes not going to do that. So i think that that is sort of rehashing some of that passion and that fervor and that spirit. Now, you know, again, were still waiting. I think a lot of people are. To see how donald trump does message that transition that hes talked about wanting to do with the American People on these subjects. And whether or not he does that at the inauguration, whether he
does that between now and then or immediately afterwards remains to be seen, but thats going to be up to him whether or not that chant has any more legs beyond this moment. Let me ask you about leon panetta because flynns got obviously the guy who seems to have trumps ear on intelligence. Trump saying hes not taking these Intelligence Briefings, hes a smart guy, doesnt want to hear the same thing every day. This is what leon panetta said. If the Intelligence Official had indications or information regarding that attack and the president did not want to listen to that, for whatever reason, the responsibility for that would go on the president. I think thats fair. I think donald trump needs to revisit that line of thinking. No one is questioning your smarts here, sir. No one is questioning your ability to digest the information. Yes, you know what, being president is boring as hell because you got to sit down and do the hard work. I mean, its hard. No one appreciates that unless youve been in that space and understand what those individuals go through. Those briefings are there for a
reason. And i would really hope that the President Elect would take to heart the sincerity and the importance of doing that because stuff happens. Minutia happens. Little things happen in the spate of hours while you rest that make a difference on the decisions you make the next day. And its important that you understand what that minutia is so that you can make the right decisions. Its funny you say this. Its almost like youre saying details matter which is something one of the president ial candidates said. Michael steele. You got it, buddy. Aleppo, syria, has become synonymous with wartorn misery particula