Carbon monoxide in his blood stream and other conditions. The family of Daunte Wright where waiting to see if charges will be filed against kim potter. Potter and the citys police chief resigned yesterday. Joining us now, nbc Morgan Chesky in Brooklyn Center, minnesota and law professor many Melissa Murray and paul butler. Welcome all. Shaq, first to you, take us through whats been happening this very detailed discussion today on heart functions and george floyd throughout the morning and i understand, first you have a report from the journalist thats been allowed in the courtroom to represent all of us. Reporter it seems as if the jury is engaged and taking notes. This Pool Reporter notes when you heard the opinion from dr. Fowler, the key opinion saying it was a sudden cardiac event during his restraint by police and mentioned contributing factors, thats when you heard or saw all the jurors start taking notes. They have been doing that throughout the testimony. Thats something they have been doing consistently as you heard from other medical experts and andrea, were in the phase of the trial now. We knew this was coming but where you have several different experts, intelligent people, world renowned people and highly respected people in many instances come up and give varying opinions and that is the purpose here. The defense, their job is to create doubt and poke holes in the testimony that you heard for the past two weeks from the prosecutions experts and thats what youre starting to hear. Dr. Fowler contradicting testimony youve heard hearing its a sudden cardiac event you had a cardiologist say no, George Floyds death was gradual. Youre hearing other elements and contributing factors come up for the first time. We heard and went through to check on this and for pretty much the first time, you heard the possibility of Carbon Dioxide poisoning being a potential cause of death or contributing factor to george floyd, not the knee on his neck for that 9 minutes and 29 seconds. That is the purpose of dr. Fowlers testimony and youll continue to hear and dr. Fowler is controversial and facing a federal lawsuit from the family of anton black when he was the chief medical examiner, it was a similar case mr. Black who was a teenager had a struggle with police and tased and put in a prone position for about 6 minutes i believe it was and during that interaction, he died and mr. Fowler, dr. Fowler ruled his death to be an accident rather than asphyxia, which other medical professionals said it clearly was. Thats what were facing and seeing in the courtroom. This is again, part of the defense doing what they can to introduce as much doubt as they can in this case against derek chauvin. Joyce vance, will the prosecution on redirect be able to bring up that anton black case in baltimore or will that be ruled out by the judge . Can you bring it up because he is an Expert Witness or not . So, the prosecution when they crossexamine this expert, they can test his credentials. They can look into whether or not he has bias. This is a civil lawsuit brought by the family that hasnt been decided yet. So the judge wont permit speculation about that particular lawsuit. But we cant really evaluate how successful a witness is until we see how they stand up on crossexamination, and so the thrust of the prosecution here will be to try to elicit testimony from this expert that shows he has in the past had a propolice bias, the judge will try and the defense but the judge will protect the record because this is all a matter of whether a verdict if the prosecution gets one can with stand scrutiny on appeal. So the judge will keep the prosecution from going too far into that dangerous territory of potentially prejudice information to keep and protect the integrity of any verdict they get. And we do have breaking news as we had suggested at the top. There is news out of that case on dante wright. Morgan chesky is there. What are we learning whether there have been charges against kim potter, the Police Officer . Reporter andrea, youre absolutely right. Within the last few minutes we heard from the county attorney here in this area and it is official, Second Degree manslaughter charges coming against former officer kim potter. That 26year veteran of the force right here in Brooklyn Center who submitted her resignation yesterday following the sunday shooting death of 20yearold donte wrielgt. The video was released on monday and captured the moment as potter reached for her side arm saying taser, taser, taser before firing the single shot that a medical examiner says was the shot that killed daunte when it struck him in the chest and he died a short time later. This is a charge we anticipated coming at some point today. Its important to note you could be charged with Second Degree manslaughter if you knowingly or consciously take a risk that results in the death of a person. We do know that at this point in time there is no official response from the family of Daunte Wright. We anticipate to hear from them at some point today in response to this. In addition to the charges coming against kim potter, we know the police chief here in Brooklyn Center also resigned yesterday, andrea and this entire department has now been placed under the responsibility of the mayor. The city manager who used to look over this has since been relieved of his duties. So a lot happening today. Well keep a close eye on this as it continues to go on and keep in mind, this shooting is still under investigation by the minnesota burro of criminal apprehension at this point in time. Andrea . Thanks so much, Morgan Chesky. Of course, there are disruptions as you know so well every night since. Let me ask Melissa Murray as a lawyer and law professor. Tell me the difference now between Second Degree manslaughter. Are there any charges that you think might have been higher charges, homicide charges against this officer . Well, manslaughter is a species upon a range of homicide crimes that might have been charged here but all of them turn on the actors state of mind at the time the conduct took place. Again, the investigation or initial investigation suggested that officer potter mistook her gun for a taser when she shot Daunte Wright so again, that seems to speak to the question of negligence or even recklessness but not necessarily intent. So typically, some of these murder charges, the most serious murder charges will flow from intent, premeditation, thats not on the table here. The real question is whether or not a seconddegree murder charge, which could be about recklessness maybe on extreme form of negligence in minnesota or manslaughter would have been on the table and it seems here that manslaughter was where they settled. And of course, we dont know all the evidence but we certainly have heard the audio tape where she says quite in shock, holy blank, you know, i shot him. So she seems shocked by what she had done, as well as everybody else, of course who has seen that horrible tape. Sorry, paul butler, i wanted you to weigh in on this, too. So we now have two Police Officers or former Police Officers in minnesota charged with Second Degree manslaughter for killing an unarmed African American man. Officer chauvin also faces those charges along with a much more serious murder charge that he faces. I think that there still needs to be an extensive investigation of the officer who killed mr. Wright. Taser mistakes happen but theyre very rare. Officers are trained to keep their tasers and guns in different locations. Tasers are designed to look really different from guns. Often, they have bright colors and different grips so how did the officer make this mistake with fatal consequences . There was another case in San Francisco oscar grant also was killed by an officer who claimed he made the same mistake. That officer was convicted of involuntarily manslaughter. You know, you make that point because weve seen the pictures how different. Theyre not always different colors but often, theyre a bright yellow or orange if theyre a taser and different weight, different grip as you point out but paul, at the same time, another piece of this is that she had come from training that very day apparently she had been involved in training. She was supposed to be an experienced trainer of other police so it gets to the larger issue of how police are trained. How police are trained and also, why this officer would taze a person doing a traffic stop for expired tags. He was unarmed and not suspected of any dangerous crime. With these cases, there is always the need for accountability for the individual officer but for the safety of the citizens of the state of minnesota, of course, questions about training, about competency, about how officers like the two who are now charged with involuntarily manslaughter, how they are allowed to remain on forces in minnesota and how many other officers like them are still out there . Joyce vance, i wanted to get to that because this also reminds me of that awful instance that we saw the viral video that just came out of a december traffic stop basically in virginia. The officers in these two instances going to tasers or other drawing guns at all when it is a traffic stop and they can follow the person. In this case, they knew where he was going. They knew his identity. They could have followed him to his home. Thats a conver vags what we want police to do. That started under the name of defending the police and that particular choice of words drew a lot of concern. Here were beginning to consider maybe they arent the best people to confront citizens with minor traffic infractions. Joyce and team, were going back to the trial and youve got eric nelson questioning dr. David fowler. What is that . Cardiac arrhythmia due to hyper tense sieve cardiovascular disease during restraint. Now, in terms of the other contributing factors to mr. Floyds death, did you, as a part of your review make other considerations to things that may have contributed . Yes, i did. Id like to discuss with you Carbon Monoxide or co. Okay . Youve reviewed all of the videos in the case, correct . I did. Did you Pay Attention to where mr. Floyds head was positioned relevant to the squad car . Yes, i did. Which way was his mouth facing . He was facing towards the rear of the vehicle and the tail pipe or tail pipes. And let me just ask you floyd died from carbon. In Carbon Monoxide poisoning, no. Id like to, if the court can and before the court does, the next slide has a screen shot from officer kings Body Worn Camera at 20 24 09. Do you see that there . Yes. How about now . Yes. Your honor, i have independently marked this single slide as exhibit 1058. Based upon discussions with counsel, id move for its admission. Objection. 1058 is received. Permission to publish . All right. Dr. Fowler, based on your review of the videos and evidence, were you able to determine if the vehicle was running . There was evidence that the vehicle was running. What would that evidence consist of . What i observed was a collection of fluid, if this is working, collection of cloud objection your honor, may we approach . Right now there is a side bar. Eric nelson had asked dr. Fowler how he knew the car was running. Earlier the issue was raised whether part of his medical problem contributing to death could have been Carbon Monoxide poisoning from the car running where he was asleep for awhile and then of course, was in the car for awhile. And theyre about to come back from the side bar. It will be dr. David fowler on the stand, eric nelson the defense questioning him. Excuse me, theyre still at the side bar discussing i guess what he can say. There was a prosecution objection to that line of questioning about the car running, how he knew the car was running and what he did get out and this could always be struck from the record is there was a collection of fluid and at that point, the prosecution interrupted. Shaq, youre outside the courtroom. The courthouse. Were talking now about the car running. The car had been running for awhile because he had been in the car and according to the woman who was next to him, her testimony, he had fallen asleep, which of course, i guess, was part of their whole case that he had been on some drugs. Shaq . Reporter right, andrea. This is a new element we heard from the defense as they were questioning dr. Fowler here. One note on the side bar, one thing the judge made clear of is he does not want attorneys to argue their objections in front of the jury. Instead, they usually will launch the objection and say the grounds for it and if there is need for further discussion, they will list the arguments in the side bar conversation and it looks like theyre coming back to the testimony now. Yeah, the trial is resuming. Lets go back and listen to eric nelson, the defense lawyer questioning dr. David fowler who is an Expert Witness, medical examiner. Dr. Fowler, based on your general knowledge as a forensic pathologist, your personal experiences, what comes out of a cars exhaust . Typically we see the products of combustion. It an internal Combustion Engine coming out the exhaust and the Major Products of combustion are going to be water vapor, Carbon Dioxide, Carbon Monoxide and a couple of other very small other particlit and minor gases that come out of the exhaust pipe. Is Carbon Monoxide toxic . It is an extremely toxic gas. How does it act as a poison . Carbon monoxide attaches to the hema globin in our red blood cells and attaches more tightly than oxygen so it competes for the same binding position on the hemo globin than ox gin does and because it binds more firmly, the oxygen cant displace it. As the percentage of Carbon Monoxide bound to your hemo globin goes up, you lose that portion of your oxygen carrying capacity. So if you have a 10 Carbon Monoxide saturation in your blood stream, youve lost 10 of your oxygen carrying capacity. Okay. Can that cause ultimately, death . When you get to levels way in excess of 50, 60 , people typically, even Young Healthy individuals will start to die. The issue is that people with significant Heart Disease and reduced capacity in their heart are going to be adversely affected earlier. So there are certainly many examples in the literature of people dying in an environment where multiple people are exposed but one person dies and that seems less than 20 and the others die at varying levels above that. So its not universal that everybody will be require to get to 60, 70, 80 as a Young Healthy individual. People with predispoing positions that are vulnerable will die at lower levels. In terms of the literature, are you familiar generally of the literature on Carbon Monoxide poisoning . Yes. Specifically are you familiar with the paper by de mayo and dana on Carbon Monoxide poisoning in open spaces . Yes, that is a paper that came out in the late 18s, i believe. Is this here as part of your power point that article or title . This is the title sheet or title portion of that particular paper that was published by the two doctors. That was in the late 80s you said . Yes. Are you aware of cdc warnings of carbon doxide in open spaces . Yes. Can you explain what this slide represents . This is the outdoor air recommendation, were talking about indoor air. Outdoor recommendations by the epa and recommending individuals are not exposed to nine parts for million for eight hours and it can put you at risk for symptoms if not more and if you go up, not much of an increase, that exposure limits drops to one hour. So in terms of the cdc versus the epa, what does the cdc say . About the same. Just be careful of Carbon Monoxide regardless of your environment. Are you familiar with the Consumer ProductSafety Commission scale . Excuse me, the Consumer ProductSafety Commission . Yes. Is that the information that you obtained for this case . So this is the top of the page that they refer to and if you go to the next slide, it actually says what it says on the page, and basically, theyre saying that most people will not experience any symptoms from a prolonged exposure to Carbon Monoxide between 1 and 70 parts per million. Some Heart Patients may experience an increase in chest pain, in other words, become symptomatic in that range. As co levels increase and remain above 70 parts per million, symptoms can include headache, fatigue and nausea and once you get above 150 to 200 parts per million, people become disoriented, unconscious and death are possible. So the higher the level, the more rapid and serious the potential consequences of exposure to a source of Carbon Monoxide is. Are you also familiar with the World Health Organization standards . Yes. Is that the next slide . This is just again the header from their document, relevant information is on the next slide. And they go a little further than the epa giving us more data and what they do is theyve got the same nine parts per million for eight hours. Their recommendation is not more than 26 parts per million for eight hours, no