Don jr. s response that was raising some eyebrows across washington. The New York Times writing, quote, when he was first asked about the meeting on thursday, he said it was about adoptions and mentioned nothing about mrs. Clinton. Then he let say he slightly modified the story. Saying after pleasantries were exchanged the woman stated that she had information that individuals connected to russia were funding the Democratic National committee and supporting mrs. Clinton. Her statements were vague, ambiguous and made no sense. No details or supporting information was provided or even offered. It quickly became clear she had no meaningful information. This morning on twitter from don jr. A little sarcasm. Im the First Campaign on the first person on the campaign to hear info about the person. And then no inconsistency in statements, meeting ended up being primarily about adoptions in response to further questions i simply provided more details. Lets get at it on this monday. We have a team of reporters on the story. Peter alexander and Ashley Parker and White House Reporter for the washington post. Ken dilanian, National Security reporter and jeremy bash, National Security analyst and former chief of staff for the cia and department of defense. Peter, i want to get you right here. We just heard new reaction from the white house. Sarah Huckabee Sanders in her off camera briefing was asked about this repeatedly. Lets walk through the highlights. Reporter well, that was the highing hiring of alan futerfas, working on behalf of donald trump jr. Hes a 25 year veteran of criminal defense cases whose expert east is in ethics investigations. Thats the breaking news within the last minutes and specific to your questions about sarah Huckabee Sanders the Deputy Press Secretary is speaking off camera a short time ago. Following the defense we have heard from other white house officials. First kellyanne conway. Among them today saying that donald trump jr. Did nothing wrong and remains no evidence and there was no collusion between Trump Campaign officials and any russian operatives. Heres sarah Huckabee Sanders in her own words a short time ago. Don jr. Took a very short meeting from which there was absolutely no followup. Frankly, i think sometimes that may make sense just looking at the Democratic National committee coordinated Opposition Research directly with the Ukrainian Embassy. This is not an accusation, but an on the record action they took. If youre looking for an example of a campaign coordinatoring with coordinating with a foreign country or a foreign source look no further than the dnc who actually coordinated Opposition Research with the Ukrainian Embassy and nobody had a big problem with that. The only thing i see inappropriate about the meeting was the people that leaked the information on the meeting after it was voluntarily disclosed. One other new detail that came out, we had heard that the president s son and from the president s outside counsel both agree that President Trump was not aware of that meeting that he didnt participate in that meeting in june of 2016. But during this briefing sarah Huckabee Sanders went a little bit further suggesting to reporters that shes under the impression he didnt learn about it until the last couple of days. So peter, what we heard from sarah Huckabee Sanders is essentially that everybody does this. Right, this is basically politics as usual. Is it . Well, you know, democratic and Republican Campaign operatives have made it clear to us, this not standard procedure. This not business as usual. s normal to meet its normal to meet with individuals to give you research on an opponent in the campaign but more likely that would be a party chair from the opposite party in a state youre competing in that may know something about the principal. In this case about Hillary Clinton. But they suggest its a very different deal when youre dealing with a foreign entity. Someone who may represent or simply be a Foreign National. There is the fear some suggest the potential that this would be violating federal criminal statutes that preclude anybody, that ban anybody from soliciting or accepting anything of value from a foreign entity. That item of value in this case may have been the opposition information that donald trump jr. Says that he was accepting the meeting for that very reason, to get that type of influence. Let me have ken dilanian pick up. You have new reporting on the potential criminality to any of this. What can you tell us about what you have learned . Thats right. I have been speaking to lawyers who practice National Security law in washington today, they make the point that collusion in and of itself is probably not a crime. Not a prosecutable offense. Its not espionage, its not working as a paid agent of a Foreign Government. If youre just sharing information. It may have been politically inadvisable to take this meeting. It certainly raised a lot of eyebrows and raised a host of questions because, you know, senior officials in the Trump Campaign were willing to take a meeting with a russian lawyer they apparently didnt know very much about. We still dont know to what extent this lawyer if at all is tied to the kremlin or was it a representative of the russian government. But in terms of criminality, my sources are telling me this is not necessarily a crime. Now, that may explain why the fbi is looking so hard at Financial Transactions among Trump Associates because thats where crimes could potentially occur. Where money changed hands. How do you think bob mueller is looking at this, this reporting thats come out now from the times is doing . We know theyre looking to talk to donald trump jr. And how do you see the special counsel moving forward on this . Even if you take the most innocent explanation that this lawyer was not formally tied to the russian government it raises a host of questions that the Trump Campaign was willing to sit down with a Foreign National to talk about potentially derogatory information about the opponent. I want raises the question about what else were they willing to do and this goes to the heart of what bob mueller is investigating. Did anybody from the Trump Campaign collude to interfere in the election . This is a piece of information that goes to motive, goes to state of mind. Richard winter he had some pretty strong statements on all of this. I want to play it. And jeremy bash, weigh in after it. The Bush Administration would have never tolerated this. If this story is true wed have the both of them would be in custody by now. Wed be asking a lot of questions because this is unacceptable. It borders on treason. Depending on if the New York Times story is true. Thats the bush ethics guy there. Whats your take away from ghaem. Well, look the story undermines the Trump Campaign that there were no meetings with russians. What i think is significant are a couple of things, halle. First of all the intent with the campaign chairman, the son of the president ial campaign and the soninlaw, so basically the high command of the campaign. The other thing i think is relevant is that this lawyer had a document and a proven track record of working with the putin government. Having a tie to the senior government officials. The other thing that is significant is the one who brokered this, rob gold stone is connected to the Business People in moscow who were working with the Trump Organization to build the trump tower. So this is part of a long standing business relationship between the Trump Organization and oligarchs in moscow. I think those things are important leads for bob mueller to follow up on. So drill down on who was involved in setting up this meeting. Ken dilanian, im coming to you. Because don jr. Was asked to attend by an acquaintance linked to the Miss Universe pageant and that was gold stone. He was asked by a russian client to arrange that talk. That client is emin agalarov. He performed at the pageant and his father has ties to Vladimir Putin. Ken dilanian, do you see any red flags in the sequencing is there . Well, sure. Its of great interest to mueller and the Senate Investigator investigators. Ing a ayla rov operates with the permission of Vladimir Putin and hes boasted they have a deal with donald trump to build trump tower in moscow and that didnt come to fruition. He brought the pageant there. And thats interesting. It certainly you know, it raises questions about trumps claim he had no business connections to russia during the campaign. You heard jeremy said that the Trump Administration now has said again and again early on they had no contacts with anybody tied to russia with russian operatives if you will. Heres what mike pence had to say back in january. Listen. Was there any contact in any way between trump or his associates and the kremlin or cutouts they had . I joined this campaign in the summer and i can tell you that all of the contact by the Trump Campaign and the associates was with the American People. Ashley, let me get your reaction there. My conversations with folks close to the Vice President point out that he joined the Canal Campaign point out he joined after this meeting. Sure, thats certainly true. I will say that the Vice President there have been a couple of high profile incidents where the Vice President has gone out on tv and said something and then hes sort of been proven wrong or undermined by the president himself. Hes either looked like a liar or someone out of the loop and one of those involved russia. It was general flynn, who said he had no contact with the russians and that turned out to be incorrect. Its very clear that the Vice President was out of the loop, he was being lied to by general flynn. And then later kept in the dark for two weeks by his own administration. He actually didnt find out until a report in the washington post. So its a tricky situation for these people to be in. You dont want to be a liar of course, nor do you want to be out of the loop and kept in the dark by your own people. Put this in perspective here. The meeting that first happened in june at trump tower, was it shady or naive to take the meeting or Something Else . Can i choose a combo of both. I think what the white house a lot of the liaisons when the meetings come up with donald trump jr. And with Jared Kushner, the president s soninlaw, its definitely naivete. We didnt know who we were taking a meeting with. A friend of a friend asked us to take a meeting. Thats dangerous way to operate. And its not necessarily nefarious, although the lying and the misleading after the fact is troubling and raises questions. This campaign did not have the procedures in place that a normal campaign would have, that before a high Level Campaign official you know who the meeting is with. You know what ties they do or do not have to the kremlin. You sort of have done your diligence. That does not seem to be happening here. Peter alexander, ken dilanian, thank you. I appreciate you joining us for top of the hour. Ill bring in the rest of the gang. With me on set is Associated Press white house correspondent, jason johnson, politics editor for the root. Com and an msnbc contributor. With us remote from washington, matt schlapp from the american conservative union. Thank you for joining us here. Let me pick whereupon the rest of the gang left off. When we ore talking about this. When we look at the political fallout, jonathan, how do you see this playing out for the white house . How do you see this playing out for the president moving forward . As peter points out the line is he didnt know about this meeting. He wasnt there. He wasnt involved. Walk me through the next steps. Well, thats right. The white house has said that the president wasnt there. He was in new york that day. And he had only become the presumption nominee a few weeks prior. It seems like the white house has a good stretch of days the word russia falls on them again. They were feeling good last week. There were questions raised about the meeting with Vladimir Putin, but they felt the president was authoritative, came back on a high note and yet this is happening again. Theyre in damage control. You are seeing donald trump jr. Deny it of course on twitter. You are seeing the surrogates being battered around a little bit. They have to assume a defensive crouch. Walk us down pennsylvania avenue because how do republican lawmakers align with trump . Is that a challenge particularly on the hill with everything that jonathan is talking about . I agree every time the topic turns to russia and russia talking to somebody in the trump family people see more smoke. And i think its important to know underneath all of this, we dont have any substantive, you know, facts on the wrongdoing. But i do think its fair for people to say, hey, you know, whats this meeting all about . Who are these people . I think well learn interesting things about the folks who are in this meeting. You worried about what you might learn . Sure. I think my advice to the to everybody involved with the Trump Campaign, at the white house is that the best communication strategy, the best political strategy is to put out all of the information that you have immediately. I think the reason why were reading about this story today quite frankly is because there were more disclosures. They modified the statements they have to make to the federal government. Jared kushner did that. Paul manafort did that. So they were able to put together the fact that this meeting occurred. I would say, get it all out. Because theres really no wrongdoing here. What there is, as it drips out it makes it look like theres more to the story than there is. If theres no there there they should have been honest from the beeg beginning. Theyre then forced to admit it. They look more and more guilty. I dont think that republicans are going to at this phase come out and fullfledged defend that there were no meetings or no collusion because i dont think they know the answer to that. I dont think any of us know the answer to that. We dont no there was any collusion or not. It doesnt look good youre lying and then forced to admit the truth. I see you itching to get in. You get first dibs after the break. I want to talk about your new piece. Well continue this conversation coming up. Ahead, more fallout after this facetoface with Vladimir Putin. Donald trump tweets about their conversations, drawing some scrutiny from both sides of the aisle. Plus, Vice President mike pences out talking about the health care fight suggesting if Senate Republicans dont pass a bill to repeal and replace, they should just repeal. But will enough republicans agree . I think theres still a path. Im not pollyannaish about this. Its difficult when you can only lose two votes and there may be two that are irretrievable. We have to give this a supreme effort. Noo introducing the easiest way to get gillette blades text blades to gillette on demand text to reorder blades with gillette on demand. And get 3 off your first order binders, done. Supercool notebooks, done. Thats mom taking care of business. But who takes care of mom . Office depot office max. This week, get this ream of paper for just one cent after rewards. Taking care of business. Are made with smarttrack®igners material to precisely move your teeth to your best smile. See how invisalign® treatment can shape your smile up to 50 faster today at invisalign. Com we recognize that russia is a cyber threat but we also recognize the need to have conversations with our adversaries and when our adversaries see strength like they did with the president in the meeting, they can look for other ways to work on shared interests and look for positive places where they can move the ball forward. Particularly on things like the ceasefire and that became a greater focus and something the president chose to stay focused on. So thats sarah Huckabee Sanders just in the last minute here, walking the line on the Cyber Security working group that the president bailed on. The fact that we discussed this Cyber Security unit doesnt mean it can happen, it cant. But a ceasefire can and did. So quite a bit different from a what he had said earlier that day which is this. Putin and i discussed forming an impenetrable cyber unit, and that came with ridicule from his own par