Republicancontrolled senate is unlikely to convict the president and remove him from office, but if they dont impeach, democrats will abdicate a clear constitutional chance to hold this president fully accountable. Now nbc news is reporting tonight that during tonights Conference Call congresswoman val demings of florida implored her colleagues to act, saying i believe we have enough evidence now. Well, democratic leadership, however, seemed to favor more cautious approach. According to politico, Speaker Nancy Pelosi told her colleagues on that call we arent going to go faster, we are going to go as fast as the facts take us. This comes after pelosi acknowledged the division amongst her caucus on impeachment in a letter today. Arguing the facts can be gained outside the impeachment hearings. Thats an argument. Well see if its true. This comes after the democratic chairmen of three powerful committees expressed similar caution when confronted with the question of impeachment on the sunday talk shows. We may get to that. We may not. As i said before, it is our job to go to go through all the evidence. Do you think this is impeachable . Yeah, i do. I do think that this if proven, if proven, which hasnt been proven yet, some of this if proven, some of this would be impeachable, yes. Im not there yet, but i can foresee that possibly coming. But, again, the fact is is that i think we have to do be very careful here. Impeachment is likely to be unsuccessful. Now, it may be that we undertake an impeachment nonetheless. I think what we are going to have to decide as a caucus is what is the best thing for the country . Well, despite the damning revelations that muellers report centered on obstruction of justice, the president said hes not concerned about possible impeachment. Here is trump at the White House Easter Egg Roll today. Are you worried about impeachment, mr. President . Not even a little bit. Trump also tweeted this morning that, only high crimes and misdemeanors can lead to impeachment. There were no crimes by me, so you cant impeach. It was the democrats who committed the crimes. See what happens when you open him up . You dont go on offense, he does. Not your republican president. A reuters poll conducted in the wake of the Mueller Report, trumps Approval Rating has cropped to the lowest of this year. Just 37 of americans say they approve of his performance as president. Im joined by u. S. Congressman ro khanna on california. Joyce vance, former federal prosecutor. Peter baker, chief White House Correspondent for the New York Times and Leigh Ann Caldwell covers congress for nbc news. Leigh ann, give us a sense, how did it go with the speaker saying lets not go with impeachment or the back benchers, who is winning . Thats a good way to put it, chris. So there does seem to be a mood shift among House Democrats on the issue of impeachment and also on these investigations. Since the Mueller Report has come out. Im told by two sources who were on the call that everyone was very concerned about the status of the country and the way that the president has been acting. And so there is a shift in the appetite for continuing investigations, but we dont yet see any talk of impeachment from the leadership, and thats where it really matters. The chairman of six important committees went through line by line on what they were investigating and were going to continue to investigate, and they said they were going to use every single tool in their arsenal. Theyre going to continue to conduct these investigations, but they did not say that they were going to start impeachment proceedings just yet, chris. Well, did the usual people who are back benchers, the young members, many of color who came into the congress, you know, aoc and others and presley, did they make statements today on that Conference Call for impeachment . Not that im aware of. I was told about five or six members did speak up, and there were a couple of members who did say they supported impeachment. You mentioned val demings of florida. She said shes been in Law Enforcement for 27 years and the facts are evident that impeachment is possible now. She really urged not waiting, just moving forward on it as we speak. Then there was another member, representative huffman of california, and he urged democratic leadership to talk about the danger of not impeaching. So he said that the messaging around the democrats shouldnt be do we impeach or not but make the case to the public that its more important to impeach than to not impeach, chris. Thanks for the great reporting. I love onsite reporting. Great for you being there and getting the information. Let me bring in congressman ro khanna. You were on that call. How is your reading . Has pelosi got the reins of our caucus and saying not now and wielding that power against impeachment. Is she there . She does, but i think her tone has also shifted post the Mueller Report. Shes also now talking about our duty to investigate this. Shes talking about the urgency. Shes saying let the facts lead where they may and lets have a strong public presentation to the American Public. Yeah, but whats that . Well, look, even during watergate it took a long time before Public Opinion changed. Okay, congressman. Youre a politician. Im watching you. I will say this. Now or never. Dont tell me some time this summer after they hear from mueller again and they hear from barr again and, oh, don whats his dmaname, mcgraw or mcgahn. You dont think thats going to change what you dont want to do now . I dont want to dive in the pool. I think muellers testimony could make a difference. Could . Do you think its probable or plausible. We just got the Mueller Report a week ago. Youre nice to come in. I think the whole caucus decided not to impeach. If youre not going to do it now, youre not going to do it in three months or six months. The redacted Little Information is going to change you from nothing to impeach the guy . I think its important for the committees to do their work and issue reports. Reuters also finds, these are interesting numbers to take home with you tonight. 67 of democrats, regular people, say he should be impeached. 2 3. 75 of democrats. This is coming after the mueller release, quit, youre not worthy to be president. So thats the backdrop im looking at. Let me go to peter baker on this. That is, of course, the people out there, just the people, but for some reason the political people dont want to go respond to that. Your thoughts, peter . Well, the poll you just cited says 2 3 of democrats think he ought to be impeached but you need 2 3 of democrats and republicans in the senate to impeach. That means you need 20 republican senators. Its been four, five days since the Mueller Report came out and you havent heard one republican suggest theyre anywhere close to the idea of supporting impeachment. For Speaker Pelosi, shes looking at this from a practical point of view. Do you go forward with something that doesnt seem to have much chance of success, simply on the idea that they ought to do it because of the matter of principle and risk whatever political backlash there might be . Or do you let this be settled at the ballot box and try to beat him, you know, on issues Like Health Care and other questions . Thats the argument youre hearing take place amongst the democrats. Peter, im not happy with the idea of partisan cheerleader. If youre right, the politics say the smartest, safest move, like all those democrats who voted for the iraq war, that was the smart move. Im so sick of the smart move. Because inevitability the smart move like in the godfather gets you killed. Because the cleverness of being against impeachment. You can impeach with just a majority of the house. You can indict this guy for history. Peter, as a journalist, you write the big story. If youre trump, would you rather be impeached than not or in the end is he just playing a game here . He knows it looks like hell in the history book to be impeached. I dont think bill clinton by the second or third paragraph in his obit is going to see impeached along with andrew johnson. Nobody likes being smacked by history in that way. Trump says come at me. I think the democrats would be smart to impeach him. Let the republicans defend this kind of behavior. Thats an argument. Let me go to joy vance here. Joyce, high crimes and misdemeanors is about as clear a phrase as Robert Muellers im not going to exonerate on obstruction of justice. It seems like not only the special counsel but the Founding Fathers left us with an uncertain trumpet. What the hell does high crimes and misdemeanors mean . It means whatever Congress Wants it to mean, chris. So you make this really good point, which is that impeachment is about the same thing as indictment. Mueller does an investigation and decides whether to indict or not, but hes looking at very limited topics. Hes only looking at whether there was a conspiracy between the campaign and the russian government and whether there was obstruction. Congress has a much wider scope here. Yeah. They can decide that just about any element of conduct is a high crime and misdemeanor. So lots of investigation, lots of opportunity to get people on board for a shared set of facts that can be used for decisionmaking. Well, while the special Counsel Robert Mueller outlined a strong case that the president obstructed justice in his report, Senate Majority leader Mitch Mcconnell is today calling on democrats to move on. I think its time to move on. This investigation was about collusion. There was no collusion. No charges brought against the president on anything else. I think the speaker has actually been discouraging talk of impeachment, but thats really up to the house. If they want to do that, they can. I think the American People would like to move on from this. Well, now lets listen to mcconnell, the same mcconnell during the impeachment talks about former president bill clinton back in the 1990s. I am completely and utterly perplexed by those who argue perjury and obstruction of justice are not high crimes and misdemeanors. Congressman, i want to ask you about something i asked you the other night, hillary clinton, donald trump, two candidates for president. If they switched position and hillary won the election in the Electoral College and it turns out the russians helped her and it turns out she played footsie with republicans with the russians, that her people were meeting with them all the time, chelsea was up there meeting in new york in some tower up there talking to the russians, all these people like manafort, all her people were talking to the russians, it turns out she tried to stop the investigation by firing the fbi director and then tried to fire the special counsel, do you doubt in a million years that the republicans wouldnt have her burning at the stake right now . They would have her out of office so fast. The democrats do not know how to play hard ball. Republicans see their opportunity and they take them. No doubt the republicans would impeach here they would have gotten her out of here by now. Heres the thing no, really, do you think she would survive in office . No, i dont. Why dont you play as tough as republicans . Because we care about the country. Do you think its good to have trump in the white house . I think its a tough, tough decision, and heres why. There is no doubt that he broke the law in muellers report. There is no doubt that he was trying to get Jeff Sessions not to be part of the investigation. Hes telling his own white House Counsel to try to fire mueller. I mean in broad daylight he did this. Its appalling, the behavior. And therefore and i get the sense of setting a bad precedent. We get it. We have to speak out. We have to make this case. The other side of this is we have to look at how polarized this country is, how deeply divided the nation is, whats going to bring us together and whats going to help have a positive agenda. I think this is genuinely weighing on nancy pelosi. Ill tell you this, chris maybe Nancy Pelosis job is to get reelected as speaker, get the House Democrat again next year. Maybe thats a different question than the president ial reelection of donald trump. Maybe thats a different question. Someone on the call, ill share this, someone on the call said what are the poll numbers, is impeachment good or not good. Nancy pelosi cut him off and said, look, this is not going to be a political decision. Weve been called by history. This is a duty we need to make the case. She is going to go for impeachment . Shes going to make the case to the American Public and see where it is. But heres the thing, chris. Back to my question, congressman, can you honestly argue me sitting here live that if they dont do it now, which is april, theyre going to do it in the summer some time . When are they going to act . I think if there is a compelling case that is made. You dont think its been made . I think i heard you make it a few minutes ago. Congress has to make it. Congress has to make it to the American Public. Heres what ill tell you i dont want to play this tough. Youre a good guy. I respect it. Look how these hearings work. So you get barr up there and he gives you nothing. Barrs a smart customer. Barr will give you nothing. Mueller is going to repeat what he said. It took him two years to write his report. Hes not going to Say Something different. Hell say i cannot exonerate him five times. Then what do you got . Youll get something from mcgahn because mcgahn is actually in the report on the record. Fire these guys and i wouldnt do it, so im gone. We already know that. I just whats new, pussycat . After all these hearings, whats going to be more impeachable than what we already got . Well, i think, one, the public is going do be more educated. People dont watch a 480page report. They watch tv. There is a difference when you have a public hearing and where public sentiment is. I will say this about nancy pelosi. Look, shes in her late 70s. Shes been speaker of the house twice. You dont think shes looking at how history is going to judge her . Shes not looking at this in the midterms. Its a deeply difficult issue for the country. A smart political move. I dont think its politics. I think its a question of her obligation to make sure okay. Im not knocking politics. It is what it is. Despite trumps insistence i have never been happier or more content, new reporting indicates hes more bitter than he suggests. According to the New York Times the president stewed about the Mueller Report in florida on friday, dismissed the findings and keeping track of who in his orbit participated in the election. How does that look, peter, looking around for the rats, as he would say . The problem is hes trying to count who in his circle participated in the investigation. He has to count almost everybody basically. Both of his white house chiefs of staff. His white House Counsel. His campaign managers. His own, you know lawyers. I mean, its hard to find too many people who were close to President Trump who were not interviewed at some point by the investigators. Many of them gave over notes. They gave over emails. Some of them might not have had a choice because of subpoenas, but, you know, he had access to basically all that they had to give. The president is looking around for scapegoats. Hes going to find a lot of possible targets. The one at the top of his list teams to be don mcgahn, his former white House Counsel, who told stories pretty damning towards the president in terms of his desire to try to thwart that investigation. Vince joyce, i dont know where vince came from. Joyce, thank you. I have to ask you the money question. Attorneys operating in washington or in new york city or anywhere else, who is going to get paid more by the hour, mcgahn who tells the truth or mr. Barr who is an excellent attorney for the president . Who do you want defending you, the honest guy or the somewhat creepy guy who looks like he helped, well, fudge the truth . You know, lawyers are only as good as their reputation, chris. So lawyers, i think, are wellserved where they Pay Attention to representing their clients but doing so within ethical bounds and telling the truth. Its really difficult, i think, to have watched an attorney general, someone who has been in the department before, take the stand at a press conference and lie to the American People and do that knowing that the report he was not telling the truth about would be released a couple of hours later and we would all be able to read it. So its inexplicable and i dont think that his legacy will be strong as a result of what hes done in the last couple of days. Well, thats good to believe. I hope i can. Thank you very much, congressman ro khanna of california. Peter baker, sir. Joyce vance not vince. Thank you so much. Leigh ann caldwell, for that on the spot reporting. Thank you so much. You make it work here. Coming up, the republicans moral compass. Who is the leader of the party . 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