Half a century in the service of our country, i shall lay down the responsibilities of office as in traditional and solemn ceremony the authority of the presidency is vested in my successor. We now stand ten years past the midpoint of the century that has witnessed four major wars among great nations. Three of these involve our own country. Despite these holocausts, america is today the strongest, the most influential and most productive nation in the world. In the councils of government we must guard against unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought by the military Industrial Complex. The misplaced power will persist. Lets bring in evan turner, hes author of one of my favorite ike books and thats saying a lot. I love reading about ike. It was ikes bluff, the secret battle to save the world. Evan, we might we had steve inscape on talking about when a president leaves office often things change very quickly. I was giving the example of dr. Brzezinski had a red phone in his house specially wired at 12 00 noon on january 20, 1981. The secret service came in, unceremoniously ripped the phone out of the wall and left a huge hole there, said see you later and got in the car and drove off and that was it. It reminded me of a hilarious scene in ikes bluff when poor ike tried to do something he hadnt done in 20 years. Tell us about that. He tried to make a phone call. He was so unmodern and so used to being cared for that when he got his new home in pennsylvania in gettysburg, he the secret service drove off and he tried to make a phone call and he didnt know that you had to dial the numbers. He thought automatically there was an operator there. You can get disconnected from the real world in high office and eisenhower did, but in a greater sense he never lost his contact with reality. He knew what truth was and he knew what power was. What can harry truman learn im sorry, not harry truman. I was talking about harry truman a lot and i was thinking about the transition because i had read a relative of harry truman of what he did to prepare eisenhower and not telling truman about anything. Despite the fact that two men loathed each other and that meeting between truman and eisenhower, the transition meeting was cold, but harry truman bent over backwards to make sure that ike was prepared. Well, you know, both of those men were so deeply steeped in our system that whatever personal animosity they had they were going to get they were going to find a way to get along. And they also had a deep recognition of the problems that the United States faced. This is the very beginning of the nuclear age and for the first time the president of the United States has the power to end the world. Thats an awesome power and both men understood it. Truman was the first to actually use the weapon, to use the Nuclear Weapon and eisenhower as the guy who has inherited this world and the sudden growth of the h bomb. In fact, just as ike was being inaugurated we were testing our first hbomb. So they knew the world in which they lived and that meant that they had to cooperate with each other. Jeff greenfield . When im thinking about eisenhower, the most striking i was a young man at the time, a teenager, is how much he was a figure of fun. He couldnt finish the sentences, not tangled up in syntax and he was quite shrewd. He said, dont worry, ill just confuse them. The other thing of course is that for people i guess that you might call sort of the left, the rightthinking left who saw in eisenhower as a kind of befuddled father figure. That line that you played, worried about the military Industrial Complex is that people on the left side of the spectrum most appreciated and said that was a warning that has not been followed in the decades since because john kennedy, his successor, worried about the prestige. You know . Ticked off a large increase in military spending. So trying to measure the president in the moment when that president leaves office is sometimes a misleading thing. Now, when this president leaves office, all bets are off. Joe, ike had a wonderful thing. He had the confidence to be humble. He didnt need to show off. I mean, eisenhower conquered europe. He approved himself many times and it gave him this kind of confidence that he didnt need to show up. He was intentionally sometimes inarticulate. As you said, theres a famous story, oh, ill just confuse them. He didnt need to seem cool because he was cool. He had been through so much that he knew when to talk and when to shut up. And he knew when to play it close to his chest, which every president has to do. Its an unbelievably lonely job and of course the desire is to be out there and to be seen by everybody. Eisenhower understood the loneliness of command. After all, he had given the order to the allies to go on dday. Very tough call. He held this kind of pressure in himself and it damn near killed him. His stomach was ripping him up. His heart was ripping him up. But he knew how to control his emotions. He had an enormous temper, he kept it, he had a big ego. He controlled it. He knew how to control himself in a way that projected as humility. And that is a wonderful thing to have in a leader. So, you know, you were talking about what a lonely job being president of the United States is and you talked about a meeting that john kennedy had with Harry Trumans secretary of state, dean atchison and boy, really drove that point home. Can you can you repeat that story for us here . Yes. It really brought it home to me. This is kennedy now, but kennedy is thinking about are we going to go nuclear against the russians in berlin during the berlin crisis of 1961. And he wants some help and they bring in old dean atchison who had been trumans secretary of state and a big hawk and they bring him in because they think that atchison is going to give a dose of stiff blood to eisenhower and make him more hawkish. But no no no no, atchison says to eisenhower, he says, you know, i think about whether youre going to use Nuclear Weapons or not. Kennedy. Im sorry, to kennedy, excuse me. I think of using Nuclear Weapons but then tell no one. The point is you cant be advertising it. This is your decision. You know, you know if you tell people you wont have any negotiating power. Your power comes from being a little bit indecipherable about this and not telling anybody. Think of the pressure on one human being on this issue. Am i going to use Nuclear Weapons or not . Eisenhower never told anyone and that gave him a kind of power because the russians didnt know. Nobody knew if ike was going to use those weapons. That gives him great power, but boy it is a lonely, terrible pressure. Unique to modern times. This began with eisenhower but its still true. You know, biden is taking office at a time when north korea has nukes. Iran is building nukes. The chinese have nukes. A lot of nukes out there and we are its not the cold war, but we are in a new place that is also dangerous. All right. Author and historian evan thomas, its always great to have you here. Thank you so much and jeff greenfield, thank you as well. Still ahead, we fast forward to two of the more recent president s, bill clinton and barack obama. Joe biden had a frontrow seat to both of those administrations, but that does not necessarily mean he aims to repeat them. Well talk about that next on morning joe. Well talk about that next on morning joe. Pain hits fast. So get relief fast. 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It is tough to look at the incoming biden presidency without reflecting on the last two democrats to hold the highest office in the land bill clinton and barack obama. Both achieved significant accomplishments, but not without their share of challenges. We spoke with historian Michael Beschloss and biographer david maraniss. Here is that conversation. So david, the two president s that you have written about recently over the recently being over the past 25 years, bill clinton and barack obama, they both came in with majorities. They both lost those majorities two years later. What can joe biden learn from both of their presidencies . Well, joe, remember when barack obama was elected, the onion headline black men given nations worst job. Think of what joe biden is falling into, you know . Not just the recession thats worse than what barack obama faced but also the pandemic and racial and economic inequity. So, you know, whatever hes learned from the past, hes going to have to deal with something that no one has really had to deal with before. I would say that with you know, he has to learn to be flexible. Whatever you think you know coming into the presidency, thats what changed them. So bill clinton came in thinking that when he needed a policy to be done right, he knew exactly who to turn to which was his wife hillary because that had worked in arkansas. Well, for various reasons, it didnt work once he got to the white house. Barack obama came in singing that song of reconciliation. The famous no red states or blue states and really believing that he could bridge that divide. And he had a Vice President , joe biden, who not only believed that as well, but was really better at trying to accomplish that. And they faced very you know, difficult times trying to do it. So whether President Biden comes in with that same idea its going to be an incredibly difficult task for him to pull off. But david, isnt timing everything also . I mean, with bill clinton, i always said and of course this will offend a lot of my progressive friends and maybe its the former republican of me speaking but i thought if he had led with welfare reform in first term and then moved in the second term to health care reform, things may have been far different for him. But he went faster i think again, maybe its just the former republican in me, but both he and barack obama moved left faster than most of americans were prepared for. And in both cases, they answered two years later the voters answered with very conservative congresses. Well, youre not the only one who made that argument about bill clinton. I mean, al gore wanted to do with welfare reform first as well. And he did suffer from that he tried to do. Now, barack obama suffered but he also accomplished something that will have lasting impact. And so the question was whether that was worth it. I think really, again, you can only learn so much from that history because joe biden cannot afford to wait around. He has too many problems to teal with right away. But youre right, timing is everything and the timing this time is crucial. Yeah. So Michael Beschloss you believe that joe biden should look at a republican and a democrat. Dwight eisenhower and what he did after his 52 landslide and fdr after his landslide. Explain. You know, joe, as you and i have discussed, id like to have a hybrid of roosevelt and eisenhower. Roosevelt roosevelt who came in 33, great depression, had to bring the country together and get the policies together and at the same time, roosevelt said the presidency is a place preeminently of moral leadership. Do we ever hear President Trump saying that . I think people are hungering for that. The reason i say eisenhower 1953, we had to deal with the democratic congress. Had to work with lip don johnson and yet, they got a lot of things done together in Foreign Policy and eisenhower did not do enough to talk about the plight of black people or latinos or poor or women, but above and beyond that, given the framework of the 1950s, he brought the country together after the traumas of the depression, world war, world war ii, cold war, mccarthyism. It was a really rocky time and with those caveats we were blessed to have someone of eisenhowers ability to bring the country together and i hope that biden can follow in the footsteps. Speaking of being blessed, i look at biden and i think of a return to normalcy and i cant help but think of two president s in the middle of the 1970s who follow the hell of vietnam and watergate. Right. It just seems to me that america was so blessed to have two undeniably good men in gerald ford and jimmy carter run the white house from 1974 the end of 74 through 1981. You know, anyone who says our system doesnt work take a look at the light 70s. Ford and jimmy carter, neither would claim they were perfect president s but if you want to design someone to heal and unify this country, you cant do better than ford and carter. Especially given what were dealing with next month with an inauguration with an outgoing president who as of this moment is threatening not to show up and to have a counterinaugural of his own to take a big bite out of the new president. Look at 1977, jimmy carter gets up and surprises gerald ford the outgoing president by saying for myself and my nation, i would like to thank my predecessor for all hes done to heal our land. These two guys who ran against each other in 1976, carter won by the narrowest of margins, yet, later on, i heard them with my own voice in the east room in the white house in 1980 say they thought they had the closest friendship between any two expresident s in the United States. And just a lesson for politicians, that was a brutal election in 1976 and it was so heart breaking to gerald ford that he had to have betty speak for him, gene robinson, the next morning. Yeah. Absolutely. Just it was devastating. I have a question for david maraniss. Good to see you, david. So you know how important it is to give a speech, you have to be about to read the room if you want to get anywhere. Yes. And i think you could argue that president obama didnt quite accurately read the room. I remember hearing him say that any day now, he thought the sort of the fever of massive resistance on the republican side to what he was trying to accomplish was going to burn itself out and it was going to somehow go away and it never did. Joe biden thinks he can reach across the aisle and sort of diminish the fever that way. Do you think hes reading that correctly or not . Thats the essential question well learn in the next year, gene. I think he believes he can do it but also i think because of the eight years of experience working with president obama and trying to deal with boehner and the senate republicans, you know, hes seasoned in terms of understanding what can be or cant be accomplished. I think that going in to the white house, he almost feels compelled to say those things and to try to work it out. But i think hes probably pretty smart about what he can actually do and in reading that room. As for obama, i always thought, you know, without getting too psychological that he believed that because he figured out so many contradictions in his own life, you know, think of all the things that life threw at him in terms of racial identity and so on that if he could work that out, why couldnt the rest of the country and why couldnt congress. And thats why he was a little bit you might say naive or not really reading the room quite right. I think joe biden doesnt have that same problem. All right. David maraniss and Michael Beschloss, we so greatly appreciate you being with us. Gene robinson, thank you so much. Still ahead, gerald ford pardoned Richard Nixon. Would joe biden consider the same for trump if it ever came to that . Well talk about the nixon era of politics and the big takeaways for the next president. Olitics and the big takeaways for the next president. kids laughing upbeat tempo sanctuary music its the final days of the wish list sales event sign and drive off in a new lincoln with zero down, zero due at signing, and a complimentary first months payment. And a complimentary to customizes yourcan gocar insurancetual. Com so you only pay for what you need . Really . I didnt aah ok. Im on vibrate. Aaah only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. 2020 thats it calling anyone with grit change this, change that, but dont ever quit 2020s done a new era has begun so keep pushing forward. Because this is twenty twenty won the future is still ours to win. Make a different future start different at godaddy. Com it is clear that the north atlantic pact is not an improvisation. Its a statement of facts and the lessons of history. We have learned our history lessen from two world wars in less than half a century that experience has taught us that the control of europe by an unfriendly power would constitute an intolerable threat to the National Security of the United States. We participated in those two great wars to preserve the integrity and independence of the european half of the atlantic community. In order to preserve the integrity and independence of the american half. It is a simple fact, proved by experience, that an outside attack upon one member of this community is an attack on all members. Welcome back. That was secretary of state dean atchison speaking about nato less than one month before its foundation. With just weeks before inauguration days, we are revisiting our conversations about what joe biden can learn about the presidency from the 45 others who came before him. Here is our conversations with historians evan thomas and walter isaacson. Lets talk about the wise men and i think the timing is perfect. This is an extraordinary book, talking about both fdr and harry truman using the best and the brightest in an age where you have the lord chancellor of britain saying, i dont think we leading up to brexit, i dont think we trust experts anymore. We dont need the advice of experts anymore and of course, Donald Trumps selecting a radiologist to lead a global fight against a pandemic. Talk about these wise men and why ha