And if you look at what happened today, that certainly doesnt auger well for what might happen 13 days from now. So, orderly transition we know he doesnt want that. We know thats not his agenda. So, just because he said that in a statement, or someone wrote that down for him in a statement, doesnt mean thats where his heart or head are at. So, hes going to continue on the lost cause. Hes raised all this money. He cant use that money to pay off his debts, his business debts, but he can keep his family and his Political Team together, making lots of money. The griff goes on. He was raising money today, today, as the terrorist attack that he incited was ongoing. So, they want to keep that going. Trump you know, tonight, the donald Trump Presidency came basically to an end, but trumpism will go on. Twothirds of the House Republicans twothirds sided with the people who overran the capitol today, who, you know, who acted violently in a way that led to the death of at least one person, maybe others. So, trumpism goes on. He wants to control that politically. He wants to control that financially. And i will believe an orderly transition on january 20th, when we wake up on january 21st. When you actually see it. Kurt bardella, there are a whole bunch of people who might find some solace in that statement that just came out, and maybe mike pence is one of them. Make mike pompeos another. Maybe nikki haley is one. Three of the people who will leave this administration possibly with a little less stink than everybody else in the administration has. Josh hawley wants to run for president. Marsha blackburn probably wants to run for president. Ted cruz wants to run for president. But Donald Trumps not saying that hes getting out of the way for that. How does that all look . Because as you know, president ial campaigns begin as soon as the last one ends. Well, and thats the thing. When i look at hawley and cruz, who clearly have been using this process and proceeding to try to jockey to be the front of the line for 2024, the reality is, trump is going to try to at least create the impression that hes definitely running in 2024 to freeze everybody in place, to stay relevant in the media. The media is the lifeblood for donald trump. Thats always been the case. And he knoecws that right now h is the frontrunner for the nomination in 2024. Hes not going to relinquish that to anybody, whether its hawley or cruz or rubio or pence. We know that the trump family the kids, jared and ivanka and trump jr. And the other daughter have political designs. There is talk of ivanka running for senate to primary, marco rubio in florida in 2022. So there are all these pieces in play to keep the trump family front and center, keep the money, keep the grip going and keeping everyone who was loyal to them who were hoping to get something out of that relationship, something in turn, theyll be left holding the bag with nothing. And mike pence, of course, will be chief among them, as we were talking about a second ago. But i agree with david here, until donald trump actually says hes going to have a peace falling transition of power, that he has accepted reality, im not going to believe it. And i think that this statement was put out in part to try to silence some of the chatter weve heard today about the possibility of an impeachment or the invocation of the 25th amendment. I think that this is the trump team trying to mitigate some of that damage, and i think the question that the trump cabinet and the members of Congress Need to ask themselves we saw today with alarming quickness how this could get out of control, how it could get dangerous and how it could get violent. Are we willing to risk this happening again . So, this is two of you now saying you dont believe it until you see it on january 20th. We still have 13 days left to go until that, jonathan alter, and there are people who today have called for impeachment. There are reports that there are legitimate discussions about the 25th amendment, invoking the 25th amendment, which we had heard before, but boy, the bar is very, very high for the 25th amendment. Youve got to have a lot of cabinet secretaries involved. And now that Donald Trumps attempted coup seems to be coming to an end and not meeting with success, i think there are a whole bunch of people who would probably rather just ride into the sunset and not deal with this. So, what happens to donald trump over the course of the next 13 days . And do you at least take this message to believe that donald trump thinks his efforts to hold onto the presidency are over . Well, i think his familys probably telling him that, because they have at least a little, tiny tie to reality, as offensive and as horrible as theyve been. Look, 13 days can be a long time. Thats how long the cuban missile crisis lasted. I wrote in my book about jimmy carter about camp david. That was 13 days with an enormous number of ups and downs. So there are a lot of turns of the wheel that can still happen. But im actually a little bit more optimistic than some of the people who have been on television tonight, and thats because this was, as weve heard from the white house, a really bad day politically for donald trump, bad day for conservatives, as ann coulter said. And you know, he is a trapped animal, in a certain way, but i think theres also a chance that he might just curl up in the fetal position now. Im not betting on it. There could be more problems. But i do have a sense that, as horrible as what happened today was, the chances of the same kind of thing happening again, like them, these terrorists attacking the inauguration site i think the odds of that are pretty slim, and i think we will have a secure inauguration and a secure transition of power and that we need to stop talking as much, so much about donald trump, and start looking forward to a Biden Administration that is going to be significantly stronger than it was before the georgia election. And so, you know, we want to start to put him on radio silence, which is where he belongs, and to start to build the kind of muscle memory of ignoring this man. He should not be treated with any respect and should not be given very much attention after he leaves the presidency. The 2024 campaign hasnt started yet, and we shouldnt let him start it. So, i hope that we can focus on joe biden, not just in the next couple of weeks, but for the next few years. From your lips to gods ears if we can talk about something other than donald trump for the next four years. We have avoided the conversations Shannon Pettypiece and i like to talk about, about the economy. We have avoided conversations on climate change. We have avoided meaningful conversations on social equity. But shannon, hes been awful busy in the last few months avoiding the most important conversation that we should have been having in america right now, and that is coronavirus. Not only has the president avoided it, but he has been incredibly busy with his conspiracy theories and his Conspiracy Theory lawyers and not relinquishing the reins of government, when, in fact, the cdc says 400,000 americans will have died by Inauguration Day. America is 4. 25 of the global population, and we will have 20 of the global deaths by Inauguration Day. Donald trump dropped all level of interest in coronavirus months ago. Right. I mean, yeah. To think of the amount of time and discussion that has been spent on the validity of the election results, which have so clearly been valid, the amount of time thats been spent talking about Election Fraud when there was no widespread or systemic Election Fraud, at a time when this country is facing one of the Biggest Health crises in its history, potentially, certainly in many of our lifetimes, with 2,000 or 3,000 people dying a day. Of course, these enormous numbers. And not to mention that, but this sluggish vaccine rollout that has been just dragging on for weeks now and not really showing signs of a real clear course correction. Of course, you know, the president saw the vaccine yes, he didnt want to tell people to wear masks and he didnt want to have to take any blame for the deaths, but he wanted to get credit for the vaccine. I mean, thats what those around him really continue to emphasize that they felt the vaccine could be his legacy. So, here we have the vaccine. And as you said, he couldnt even find interest in that or take a leadership role in trying to expedite this vaccine to people. I mean, the numbers, the small amount of vaccine thats actually gotten into arms, i mean, it has really just been staggering for doctors. So, yes, among all of this going on with the pandemic, there has been this time spent really on this silliness about nonexistent voter fraud. I will ask you to all take a break. I want to leave our audience, and were going to come back and show you again, the moment, the historic moment in which the Vice President of the United States, mike pence, declared that joe biden will be the 46th president of the United States. S welcome back. Im ali velshi. It is 4 00 a. M. On the east coast, following a violent day unlike any we have ever seen on capitol hill, a day that has ended with this historic moment at 3 41 a. M. The whole number of electors appointed to vote for president of the United States is 538. Within that whole number, a majority is 270. The votes for president of the United States are as follows joseph r. Biden jr. Of the state of delaware has received 306 votes. Donald j. Trump with the state of florida has received 232 votes. The whole number of electors appointed to vote for Vice President of the United States is 538. Within that whole number, a majority is 270. The votes for Vice President of the United States are as follows kamala d. Harris of the state of california has received 306 votes. Michael r. Pence of the state of indiana has received 232 votes. The announcement of the state of the vote by the president of the senate shall be deemed a sufficient declaration of the persons elected president and Vice President of the United States, each for the term beginning on the 20th day of january 2021, and shall be entered together with the list of the votes on the journals of the senate and the house of representatives. And that is the whole ball game. Just minutes after that, even donald trump released a statement. It cannot be termed a concession because he continues to falsely claim that he won the election, but the statement does promise an orderly transition of power on january 20th. The president s small move toward normalcy comes less than a day after he sparked one of the worst moments in american democracy. Following a push by donald trump to march on the capitol, his supporters did exactly that. Violence erupted as thousands of insurrectionists invaded the capitol, fighting with Law Enforcement and leading a hostile takeover of the heart of democracy. Want to go first to nbcs garrett haake, who has been standing by with me all evening and morning on capitol hill. Garrett, this is a different moment from us than one that you have been enjoying since november 3rd. Reporter yeah, i think thats right. And you know, look, this is the end of this entire process. This was this broadest moment for mike pence that we all knew was coming. This was inevitable. And now it happened, 13 hours later than it needed to, with four more people dead who didnt need to lose their lives. Four people dead. Yep. Reporter at the United States capitol today, for counting votes, for a ceremonial action like lighting the Rockefeller Center christmas tree. I mean, there is nothing about this that had to happen. But in this performative action today and in this riot incited by the president of the United States, people lost their lives here today for a conclusion that we could have done today and had people, you know, home in time to pick up their kids from school or to be watching the news at dinner talking about this 32nd story of the vote count today. Just an extraordinarily sad moment. Four people died on a day in which something happened that was procedural that i guarantee most of our viewers have never paid attention to in prior elections. Its not even a day that was relevant. You kind of registered that there was an Electoral College actual vote at some point, and then the inauguration. But it was election day and it was inauguration for most people, except us political reporters. Reporter yeah, you know whats funny about today, even as a political reporter who covers this, the one thing that i think i remember from this day that i think a lot of political junkies know is that people joke about the mahogany boxes, right . Theres this the theater of this these big wooden boxes that the electoral votes comes in, and its one of those things thats sort of talked about every four years. We dredge this back up. Its the political ceremony that surrounds this whole process that is, like, kind of goofy and a throwback in a lot of ways, but its part of what ties inauguration after inauguration and peaceful transfer of power one after another together through the decades and the centuries. And today, it took a quickthinking congressional aide to snatch those boxes out of the chamber today so that the hooligans running through the capitol didnt run off with the electoral votes. I mean, we are so far beyond the bounds of normal and what we all collectively experienced today that i think its going to take a long time for exactly what this all means and was to settle in. I know it will for me. We have had for the first time in maybe ever a result in which the president of the United States wasted no time in tweeting about something in a way that did not seem to further enflame things. Theres speculation that donald trump didnt write that tweet, because its sort of not Donald Trumps language. Reporter yeah. But the idea that he says theres going to be a peaceful transfer of power on january 20th feels like a whole lot to give up for a guy whos got 13 days to go and has thrown in a match into a fuelfilled room almost every single day since the election. Reporter yeah, ali, look, i moonlight as a White House Reporter sometimes on a fillin basis, and heres one thing ive learned pretty quickly. Its that statements from aides, be they on twitter or to the cameras or on paper, purporting to be the thoughts of this president are almost never really the thoughts of this president. I mean, we have to report them. This is the way that the white house functions. Its, frankly, the way that we as reporters are conditioned. A senior aide says x about the president s thinking. We should report that. But with this president more than any other, that is so often not the case that its just hard to take this seriously. What happens to all of those people who came to d. C. To defend this presidency against the steal . Reporter thats a good question. You know, ive covered major protests and largescale events like this in d. C. Before. The mpd will take over the investigation of this criminal element here today, and theyre pretty good, actually, at finding the people from security cameras, from social media, you know, at tracking down people who broke the law here in d. C. And i dont think theyre going to spare much effort to do that, because there is another major event here that shares all these same risk factors coming up in two weeks, and thats the inauguration. And just like we saw a few days ago, the leader of the proud boys getting arrested by d. C. Police when he returned to d. C. On charges that stemmed from the last act of hooliganism here in the district, so, too, i think many of these people who could be identified as bad actors, will face their day in a d. C. Court, ultimately, should they stay. I should also point out that the city is taking a much more aggressive posture in terms of policing now, arguably, that they should have taken 24 hours ago, around the district with this curfew and with the extension of an emergency order that will, hopefully, keep this 700,000 District Residents safe as this continues to get sorted out. Garrett, doing yeomans work. I dont know when the last time i didnt see you on tv was, and i dont know if its going to be for a while. But ill join you in d. C. Im on my way there in a few hours and were going to see whats going on tomorrow and whether things get on to some track that resembles a little bit more normal on the way to the inauguration. Garrett haake, thanks a million. By the way, there might be occasion for us to speak in the next 40 minutes or so, the way things go these days. So, thank for being with me tonight. Reporter thanks. I want go to our panel. Beth fouhy senior politics editor for nbc news, michael sta star hopkins served on the campaigns of president obama, Hillary Clinton and john delaney, is a Founding Partner of north starr strategies. And john holler wanger is a senior politics reporter for business insider. Welcome to all of you. Thanks for being with us. My old friend, beth, im going to start with you, because you and i, as you know, ive told people on the show, i learned most of what i know about political reporting from you. You were my first boss in the business. You didnt teach me about this. You didnt teach me to expect days like this and weeks like this and things that i mean, you never taught me about this. One has to think, or hope, ali, that the presidency of donald trump is sui generous in this regard that no other president , hopefully in our certainly not that has come along so far and certainly, hopefully, nobody thats coming next would provoke this kind of act. But i think theres a longer view that we all need to take, which is something about President Trump has produced the sort of umbilical connectio