Transcripts For MSNBCW The Last Word With Lawrence ODonnell

MSNBCW The Last Word With Lawrence ODonnell August 19, 2014

Breath every nightfall. Governor jay nixon ordered the National Guard to the city the guards mission here will be limited in scope their presence can escalate the situation even further. They keep giving all this force. We dont need that. Tensions are rising because of another night of violence. Were wellequipped to handle this mission. What people are calling disorder is really people crying out. There were demonstrators who were out in faceoffs with police. Feels like were going back to the 60s. Seek to heal rather than to wound each other. They want to see cripple natural charges against this officer wilson. The wheels of justice are flow. Prooipt autopsy performed on Michael Brown showed Michael Brown was shot at least six times, including twice in the head. Extremely disturbing to me. The attorney general himself will be traveling to ferguson on wednesday. Theres not a whole lot of faith in how this is being handled. Ive never seen a situation more poorly handled. The grieving brown family pleads for justice. Arrest this man and make him accountable for his actions. The trust has been broken. Why is officer will wilson still walking free . Th more violence, theyre going to need the National Guard. There is no curfew tonight but the National Guard has moved into place there and president obama is not so sure that thats such a great idea. This was a stateactivated National Guard, so its under the charge of the governor. This is not something that we initiated at the federal level. I spoke to jay nixon about this, expressed an interest in making sure that if, in fact, a National Guard is used it is used in a limited and appropriate way. Ill be watching over the next several days to assess whether in fact its helping rather than hindering progress in ferguson. President obama had more to say today about the situation in ferguson. Our Constitutional Rights to speak freely, to assemble, and to report in the press must be visible lantly safeguarded. Especially in moments like these. Theres no excuse for Excessive Force by police or any action that denies people the right too protest peacefully. Ours is a nation of laws. For the citizens who live under them and for the citizens who enforce them. Right now, what we have to do is to make sure that the cause of justice and Fair Administration of the law is being brought to bear in ferguson. In order to do that, weve got to make sure that we are able to distinguish between Peaceful Protesters who may have some legitimate grievances and may be longstanding grievances, and those who are using this tragic death as an excuse to engage in criminal behavior and tossing molotov cocktails or looting stores. And that is a small minority of folks and may not even be residents of ferguson. But they are damaging the cause. Theyre not advancing it. Joining me from ferguson, tremaine lee, National Reporter for msnbc. Com. Tremaine, we just heard from captain johnson. We got video of him saying, so far, so good tonight in ferguson. Its almost eerie how quiet it is compared to the nights before. By this time yesterday, there were already police mobilizing. Protesters were already taking their positions. Now, because theres a no standing order, so anyone that stops even for a moment is told to keep moving. So the group is actually just marching up and around the block and all the way down the street. You hear now, there are deep lulls. Then sometimes you realize how thick the crowd still is. They come by chanting. As i dont know if theyre growing but its a thick crowd. Again, theres nothing right now to indicate that any fireworks are on the way. Were also joined now by chad garrison, the editor in chief of the riverfront tyimes. Chad, it seems from just looking at the way these decisions have been made in sequence that somebody there decided the curfew wasnt working. Yeah, well you know, this is as you know unprecedented in st. Louis. And i think that theyre somewhat grasping at straws looking for some way to kind of quell the unrest. And, you know, perhaps this keep moving initiative today will do that. Seems to be bearing out at least so far. Lets listen to more about what president obama had to say about this today. I have to be very careful about not prejudging these events before investigations are completed. Because although these are issues of local jurisdiction, the doj works for me when theyre conducting an investigation, ive got to make sure that i dont look like im putting my thumb on the scales one way or the other. Tremaine lee, have you gotten any sense from people in the street today what their reaction to president obamas comments today has been . Yeah, over the course of the week when the president and then attorney general eric holder weighed in, people definitely appreciated. One of the things they want, there are a few, but one is to be heard. To be heard at the highest levels of government of the United States means something. And i think there is extraordinary pressure. These are issues that black people in this Community Care deeply about. And they want their black president to care deeply about their feelings. So people appreciate it. But then people are also asking, what next . I talked to one person who commented on the calm and the no standing rule and how everyones so in order. Hes saying, basically, i feel like ive been coopted. Protest when is youre protesting authority. Here theyre doing exactly what authority wants. Also i think some people may be tired of the gassings and violence. Back to your point, people appreciate it but they want answers. They want transparency. Ultimately they want an arrest. Chad garrison, what is your sense of the reaction in the larger st. Louis community outside of ferguson and areas nearby . This is the remains the most talked about story, obviously it seems like i dont have a nationwide perspective because im here in st. Louis, but this is all that everyones talking about. You know, i think to tremaines point earlier, i think that at this point people want really to see leadership from barack obama and maybe it is actually coming here to st. Louis. But people want this resolved. This is the ninth night. And hopefully thats going to happen but it just doesnt seem like theres an end in sight. Tremaine lee, chris hayes has been making a great point that the big show of force after some sort of event by some people who want to kind of provoke that show of force, they are rewarding, in effect, the people in that who find their bay into that crowd to do something specifically provocative to the police. So obviously a very small number of people who have been doing that. But they seem to want to provoke that big militaristic response. And what chris hayes keeps wondering about, is there going to be a way to break that cycle . That very well could be. But the police presence, even when its not so highly militarized, sparks confrontation. Because the mood changes. People are chanting and being heard, then you have a Police Officer barking orders at you. You have police cars running up on the side of the roadblocking the road. There are factions. I was speaking with malik sabaz, black lawyers for justice, doing an impressive job of keeping folks in line and keeping orderly, who kept saying theyre agent provocateurs, were not going to let them sabotage what theyre trying to do here, and tonight this peace showed people you can come and march peacefully in the name of Michael Brown. So there is this belief there are people that are part of this joining in the crowd just to be provocative, just to cause trouble, and frankly seems like the leadership, theyre tired of that action because its overshadowing what they care deeply about, justice for Michael Brown and a brighter light on what they see as a long line of Police Brutality and police harassment. Tremaine lee, well come back to you if theres any more developments on the street there. Thank you very much for joining us tonight. Chad garrison of the riverfront times, thank you for joining us tonight. Youre looking at protests occurring on west flores dent avenue. If you go north youlling into the town of dellwood. Joining me is is dellwood mayor reggie jones. Mayor jones, what is your reaction to the National Guard moving into this neighborhood . Well, this time lawrence, i think that we needed some support. Last night the Police Officers pushed a line further up west flores dent, which left the dellwoodside unprotected, we didnt have enough police fourth on that end. At this point to protect my residents and my businesses i have to be in favor of anything thats going to allow us to have more protection. We had over eight businesses looted as of last night. So my residents are getting very scared that this is coming closer and closer to us. Is im in favor of some any kind of heightened security for my community. Talk to us about the politics of these two communities, yours versus ferguson, and how ferguson can be a majority Africanamerican Community and yet not see that represented in their elected officials. Well, dellwood was the same way for many years. We also had a police force that had some issues as well. But we found individuals to run for the council. We found individuals like myself to run for mayor. So that we can get inside the government and make the necessary changes we needed to make. And just changes that will be fair to the people. We have a diverse community. Its very important that you have a diverse city as far as your Police Department, your city hall staff, your department heads. People want to see people that look like them. Thats just a fact. Even dellwood is 80 africanamerican, 20 caucasian. The 20 wants to see individuals that look like them, as well as the 80 . So weve worked hard to make sure that our city has diversity. We make sure our Police Department is connected to the residents of dellwood. We have whats called a Citizens Academy for the residents there, a way for the residents to get a better relationship with our officers. Our Police Department sponsors many events for our youth. So you have to do that kind of work on the front end so when you have an incident like this it wont be as bad for your city. And what is your reaction to the political response that youve heard from washington . Youve heard the president speak about this now a number of times. Im not talking now about the specific action hes ordered at the Justice Department. Were going to talk about that later in the show. But his overall the president s overall response to whats going on in your area there. I think the president has his finger on the pulse. Hes a midwest guy. He understands the makeup of whats going on here in this area. And its not just about ferguson. There are several communities in this area that have the makeup that ferguson has where you have majority africanamerican communities but not africanamericans in leadership. And i only fault the residents for not voting. You cant blame a councilman who wants to be there, and he gets enough votes to get him on the council. But the council does have council and mayor does then have responsibility to make sure that the city is diverse. So that all residents can be heard and all residents feel like theyre part of whats going on in the city. Mayor reggie jones of dellwood next door to ferguson, missouri, thank you very much for joining us tonight. Coming up, todays preliminary autopsy report. Sean parcells, the man who assisted at that autopsy of Michael Browns body, will join me next. Vo this is the summer. The summer that summers from here on will be compared to. So get out there, and get the best price guaranteed. Find it for less and well match it and give you 50 toward your next trip. Expedia. Find yours. Caman thanks, captain obvious. Wouldnt stay here tonight. Captain obvious id get a deal for tonight with deals for tonight from hotels. Com. And you might want to get that pipe fixed. The man who assisted at the autopsy commissioned by Michael Browns family will join me to discuss the findings of that autopsy. And just how they match up or dont match up with witnesses testimony so far, thats next. Twelve brands. More hotels than anyone else in the world. For a chance to win one million dollars, visit wyndhamrewards. Com in the nation, the safest feature in your car is you. Add vanishing deductible from nationwide insurance and get 100 off for every year of safe driving. Which for you, shouldnt be a problem. Just another way we put members first, because we dont have shareholders. Join the nation. Nationwide is on your side. His long day of doing it himself starts with back pain. And a choice. Take 4 advil in a day or just 2 aleve for all day relief. Honey, you did it baby laughs there was a witness statement that said he was walking away and the gun goes off and he kind of jerks. So the question asked to us was, could that wound occur from him walking away and then he turns around . Its consistent with that. However, understand too that while the shot could have come from the back, because if im standing here walking along and get shot from that direction, you see i pull my arm up, its in that same general area. The arm is a very mobile part of your body. It also could have occurred when he was putting his hands up. So i put my hands up and you see where that wound is at. It could have happened if he put his arms across in a defensive manner. Joining me now is Shawn Parcells, the pathologist assistant who worked with dr. Michael baden on the autopsy whose preliminary results were revealed today. Shawn parcells, there are a lot of people out there tonight saying, okay, these preliminary findings are out and we now have conclusive proof that he was not shot from behind, that he was that Michael Brown was facing the officer for every one of the shoots fired. What would you say to that . Our preliminary results agree with that, other than as i pointed out at the press conference, this shot to the right forearm could have come from the back as hes walking away. But it also could have come from the front direction if hes put his hands up, put his hands up in a defensive position, or even if hes running at the officer, you can still have that part of your arm exposed. And thats why its very important that we understand the events that occurred and be able to piece those together and look at further evidence, which at this time dr. Baden and i have not been able to do. But as you say, the possibility that that arm was shot from behind is still there, and so there is the possibility your findings dont rule out in any way that shots were fired at him from behind as he was running away . Correct. At this time, we know for a fact that he was not shot in his back. When i say his back, i mean his back. But a shot from behind hitting the arm at that angle could have happened. At this point in time, we cant rule we cannot rule that out. I want you to listen to what Tiffany Mitchell said, a witness to these events, said on this program. Let listen to this. As i come around the corner, i hear tires squeaking. As i get closer i see michael and the officer wrestling through the window. Michael was pushing, trying to get away from the officer. The officers trying to pull him in. As i see this i pull out my phone because it just didnt look right. You never see an officer and someone just wrestling through the window. So as i pull out my phone the first shot was fired through the window. And i just like tried to get out of the way. It pulled into the parking lot right beside where the cop car was and thats when michael kind of broke away and started running down the street. The officer gets out of his vehicle and he pursues him. As hes following him hes shooting at him. And michaels body jerks as if he was hit. Then he turns around, he put his hands up. The officer continued to walk up on him and shoot him until he goes all the way down to the ground. Is there anything in your preliminary findings that contradict anything that Tiffany Mitchell said . No. Actually, not at all. Her statement could be collaborated with what dr. Baden and i found, given that shot to the arm could have come from the back. I will add that dr. Baden and i did talk about that and one thing that we want to be very careful is that Michael Brown could have jerked for two reasons. One, he could have jerked because he was hit there. Or two, he could have jerked because any time any of us, im sure, would hear a gun go off unexpectedly, we kind of would jump. Again, we cant rule out that the shot came from the back. But we also cant rule out the shot came from the front. Without being able to look at further evidence which at this point in time we have not been able to do. And the other thing that you dont know, none of us know, is exactly how many shots were fired. Apparently the weapon that was probably used could fire about a dozen shots. We do know that one of the shots actually went into someones house and that bullet had to be recovered by police in at least one house. So it may be that as with many shootings by police, most of the bullets missed. And there could have that kind of reaction youre talking about, about he hears a shot fired and he physically reacts to hearing a shot fired, that could have happened many times . It could have, yes. One thing i want to stress that really wasnt stressed at the press conference is that theres really two parts to an autopsy. You have the physical autopsy of the body. Then you literally have the autopsy of the crime scene. And its very important that we find out how the crime scene is put back together. What happened in the car . What processing did they do in the car . If a gunshot did go off in the car, what direction is that bullet traveling . The clothing mr. Brown was wearing, we need to be able to look at that. We also feed to know what happened after the event that occurred in the car to the point to where mr. Brown collapsed on the ground and what is the conference

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