Pressure from the investigation. It leaked. The New York Times saying trump said, i just fired the head of the fbi. He was crazy a real nut job. I face great pressure because of russia. Thats taken off. Thats not all. On that same day, mike pence was publicly denying what trump was privately telling those same putin appointees in a comment that would later be shredded by Donald Trumps own Public Statement to lester holt. What about the president s dissatisfaction with the russia probe . Did that play into this, sir . Let me be very clear, that the president s decision to accept the recommendation of the Deputy Attorney general and the attorney general to remove director comey as the head of the fbi was based solely and exclusively on his commitment to the best interests of the American People. Some statements dont age well. Tonight a year later we know that even trumps allies dont bother claiming anymore the comey firing was about a recommendation from Rod Rosenstein and jeff sessions. Everyone knows it was a trump idea. He even owns it. But that day pence was eager to adopt the company line, whatever the company line was. Which brings us back to today. Because if you want to know the company line in this administration, you want to know exactly what the official trump position is, the exact talking point offered with no independence and certainly no improvisation, turn to mike pence. You know, former trump lawyer ty cobb, he may have been too cooperative with mueller for trumps taste. And the new trump lawyer Rudy Giuliani, he may be too chatty, but mike pence, boy, does he stick to the script. Here he is today telling Andrea Mitchell mueller needs to wrap it up. What i think is its been about a year since this investigation began. Our administration has provided over a million documents. Weve fully cooperated in it. And in the interests of the country i think its time to wrap it up. And i would very respectfully encourage the special counsel and his team to bring their work to completion. Very respectfully. You know whos not in charge of an investigations timeline . The people under investigation. And mike pence knows that. He also knows that trump has certain things he wants to hear and he knows his own former republican colleagues in congress are now literally threatening impeachment against muellers boss while demanding that they receive classified documents in the middle of this probe. Its telling that the i word is coming more from House Republicans about Rod Rosenstein than from anyone else about trump, and their line in the sand is not even a pretext or a cover story. Theyre literally saying they want the doj to tell them where the probe is headed, demanding an unredacted version of what you see right there, that classified august memo that authorizes mueller to investigate certain enumerated targets. That memo is muellers road map. And it reflects the criminal evidence that he and the fbi found, which they say warrant going potentially beyond muellers original mandate and thus rosenstein has to approve it under the rules. And we only know that because the manafort part was later unredacted and revealed after his own indictment. The other targets, the people who maybe havent been indicted yet and maybe they wont be, but those people, that part of the map is redacted. Its so secret that even a judge in manaforts trial, who is authorized to see classified material, has not been provided the unredacted parts of this proverbial map. And the d. O. J. Says they wont give it to these politicians in congress. They cite the Ongoing Investigation as well as, quote, longstanding principles of investigatory independence. At the same time the House Intelligence Committee chairman devin nunes says he wants to hold d. O. J. Officials in contempt for not releasing information about a secret intelligence source tapped by mueller. D. O. J. Rebuffing that request as dangerous and could involve the potential loss of human lives. Now, there is a flashback here. This whole scuffle echoes House Republicans quest to release secret surveillance information through that famed nunes memo. Many experts concluded the republicans lost that message war over the memo. It showed that trump aide carter page was surveiled but lawfully under a judges orders, so it didnt seem to make the d. O. J. Look that bad. But lets be clear. Republicans did manage to break a precedent with that pressure. They got stuff out that usually doesnt come out. They got some of what they wanted through threats and hostage taking. And that can embolden more threats and hostage taking. Rod rosenstein, he may have been slow to learning that lesson about House Republicans. This is the man, after all, who effectively got bullied into joining trumps cover story for comeys firing. You see his name there on that infamous letter about it. And then of course he fled from that mess by appointing mueller. But lately, and this is very important tonight, lately Rod Rosenstein says hes had enough. I can tell you the different people who have been making threats privately and publicly against me for quite some time, and i think they should understand by now, the department of justice is not going to be extorted. Last week the New York Times reporting that the Deputy Attorney general and the top fbi officials now suspect republican lawmakers are using these oversight responsibilities to try to gain intel about the open investigation and then feed it back to the white house. That alone is an explosive claim. Republicans in the House Intelligence Committee this week are still continuing this offensive. Theyre demanding documents. Theyre trying to go around the d. O. J. And appeal directly to the president to intervene. The president can decide whether they should or not turn over these documents. The president should make that decision. Our position right now is the Justice Department has to turn over these documents. But if they dont, though, would you support a contempt resolution . Were not going to go there. The president can order them to do it. Im counting on the president to do the right thing. That was tuesday. Today speaker of the house paul ryan adding his pressure joining the ranks saying the d. O. J. Must hand over the documents to republicans. I think this request is wholly appropriate. Its completely within the scope of the investigation thats been ongoing for a while with respect to fisa. I actually think that this is something that probably should have been answered a while ago. Its our job to do oversight of the executive branch. This request is perfectly appropriate within the scope of the committees investigation. And i hope and believe and expect that theyll be complied with. So you support chairman nunes . Absolutely. I think its a completely appropriate request. Meanwhile, the top democrat in the Intelligence Committee weighing in today. Virginia senator mark warner saying, bombarding the Justice Department with document requests simply to create a pretext for firing or impeaching our nations senior Law Enforcement officials is a blatant abuse of power that should concern everyone who believes in the rule of law. So we dont know exactly how Rod Rosenstein, muellers boss, is going to walk this line, how hes going to do what he said, uphold a somewhat unpleasant part of the d. O. J. , which is to Tell Congress sometimes you cant have everything you want just because youre demanding it when we have an open probe going on. We also know that today congressman nunes and trey gowdy went to the Justice Department to meet with rosenstein and then released a statement saying they had a productive discussion with officials from the office of the director of national intelligence, the department of justice and fbi in which we raised questions related to information requested from the intelligence community. The officials are committed to holding further discussions on these matters and we look forward to continuing our dialogue next week to satisfy the committees request. Republicans are basically saying this whole thing is punted for maybe a week and they have of course been pressing for this for weeks and they are using the i word. They are threatening impeachment of d. O. J. Officials. But lets be clear about something tonight. This fight has been going on since before there was even a special counsel probe. Its actually been going on since before President Trump fired james comey, and it was documented by comey in those memos he took because he said he was concerned. He memorialized this pressure from congress in the memos here on march 30th after a specific phone call with President Trump. He writes he had not testified before congress as a volunteer, the president then asked, look at this, whos driving that . Is it nunes driving it . Quoting comey, i said all the leadership wanted to know what was going on, and i mentioned senator grassley had even held up the deputy a. G. Nominee to demand information. Two things there. One, that deputy a. G. Of course is Rod Rosenstein, the one under pressure now. And two, what extent is donald trump involved in creating that pressure that ostensibly is coming from these House Republicans . Pressure which seems to be ramping up right as the pressure on Michael Cohen is ramping up tonight. To dig into it i turned to congressman Eric Swalwell. He sits of course on the House Intelligence Committee. Thank you so much for being here tonight. Good evening, ari. The times reporting that rosenstein and others now view this as an activity by House Republicans to get this material over to the white house. Is that appropriate . Is it potential obstruction . Not appropriate. Looks a lot from where i sit as obstruction and that these individuals are acting as the president s fixers in congress, who are seeking simply to have the department of justice say no so they can create the circumstances in which President Trump can fire either rosenstein or sessions or both. And if they do get the information, weve seen in the past where this information goes. If you remember the republican memo, they took that information and it actually ended up over at the white house. Sought white house was able to see as subjects to the special counsels investigation evidence that existed in the case against him. That is not how you run any investigation. You would never give suspects or subjects in an investigation the keys to the evidence locker at the fbi. Do you think Rod Rosenstein is up for this fight . Yeah. He sure looks like hes up for this fight. And if he gives in on it, he will allow future members of congress to weigh in and influence investigations. And thats just not how it works. I think hes going to hold firm here because he knows whats at stake. You cant let that safe crack. Your colleague, congressman adam schiff, who viewers know from many of his discussions on this, was briefed about this at the d. O. J. Do you have any information from that briefing . I dont, ari. And frankly, when it comes to Ongoing Investigations i think congress should stay out. And so you know, mr. Schiff is in whats called the gang of eight, and lets keep it compartmentalized that way. Of course we have an oversight rule, once the investigation is over. But we really should be playing a very limited role right now as a special counsel. Who does his job, follows the evidence, and tells the American People who was responsible for what happened last president ial election. What does it look like if a congress does try to move forward with impeaching a d. O. J. Official like mr. Rosenstein . Green lights. It looks like paul ryan and Mitch Mcconnell seem to have sanctioned this type of behavior. They have done nothing to shut down efforts like this. Mitch mcconnell in fact is not allowing the Bipartisan Legislation that came out of the Senate Judiciary committee that would protect bob mueller to come to the floor. When people think back to for example the clinton impeachment proceeding would it look like that . Would there be a senate trial . What are they threatening to do . Theyre threatening right now to hold attorney general sessions in contempt. That would not be a trial. If they wanted to move beyond that of course the house could vote to impeach and then the senate would conduct the trial. I hope it doesnt come to that, ari. Again, that would really encroach on the rule of law. Its really people like paul ryan and Republican Leadership who need to i think stand up for the rule of law rather than looking the other way. And thats what we continue to see. Congressman Eric Swalwell right in the middle of this story. Really appreciate your time. My pleasure. I want to turn to matt miller, former spokesman under the former eric holder. Thank you for being here. Put this in the context of precedent, which isnt always that informative in the trump era because they seem to delight in breaking precedent. How does this compare to the inner branch debates you guys had . Certainly eric holder did face a house willing to hold him in contempt. Right. So theres one thing thats important to know. There are no statutes. Theres nothing in the constitution that really governs this area. Its all based on norm and precedent, in some limited areas, some Previous Court cases. Theres kind of three areas. One bucket where the department of justice always provides information to congress. One bucket in the middle where they sometimes provide information to congress, Something Like certain privileges like executive privilege. Then theres a third bucket thats always been a red line the department has refused to cross and that relates to Ongoing Investigations. And the department has always taken the positions that it will not provide that information because it can jeopardize the investigation by tipping off potential subjects, what they might face under questioning. And then theres kind of even beyond that, if you look at this, the exact information thats in dispute here. What the department of justice has said is there is a classified source providing intelligence information whose life would be endangered if this information came out. It is so far beyond the pale of anything the department has turned over in the past that you know, theres no excuse for Congress Taking this extremist position. Thats all on the norms and the precedent, as you say. Then theres what it would actually look like if we unredacted this road map, this very secretive road map that rosenstein and mueller have. And i suppose the most responsible way to explore this is with the part that has been removed and unredacted, which is that he was authorized to go farther into manaforts history than just 2016. If that had been unredacted earlier, before manafort were charged, among the other problems weve discussed wouldnt that be enormously unfair to Paul Manafort . Isnt there a problem here, that this would be a wrecking ball to other people that mueller and rosenstein have not finished deciding whether they should even be charged . Yeah, its absolutely right, ari. One of the things at the department of justice, one of the rules is you dont talk about investigations, you dont share the product of investigations until its finished and even when its finished only if youre bringing charges because it doesnt give people an opportunity to defend themselves. If it named, for example, roger stone or donald trump jr. , any of the other people in the trump orbit and it said what allegations the department is investigating that automatically puts those people under suspicion in a way thats not really fair to them because theres no way for them to clear their name publicly. I doubt the members of the house are all that concerned or thought that through, but it is an important reason that is consistent with the departments longstanding rules of not unfairly implicating those under investigation. And based on what has emerged publicly including doj court filings, there is a legal rationale for the idea that under that redacted portion might exist Michael Cohens name because we know from the referral that mueller has determined that part of the probe should require some other jurisdiction than just his. Do you have any idea from what is publicly available who else might be under that black box . I think its almost certain that the president himself would be under that black box. It was reported shortly after the investigation began that the president was under investigation for obstruction of justice, and i think its actually pretty clear thats what bob mueller was appointed in the first place. If you remember, he was appointed about ten days after comey was fired and it was only after the comey memos became public and rosenstein saw those memos and it was clear that the president had had this series of inappropriate interactions. Whoever elses name we might see in that, you can think of all the people in the trump orbit who have surfaced in this investigation, it would almost certainly include the president himself. Were out of time but that makes me really want to ask you. Do you think