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Murder, intend to kill, her little girl, but it was an accidental drowning that was covered up by her father who's a sexual abuser, and then the -- >> bill: so the defense has not been able to prove that just yet, which would indicate that they're not making money inroads in the state's case. you believe that, right? >> i dobl that. that's why i think she should have to take the stand. bill: let me get to that in a moment. joey, what do you think about that, is the defense doing anything? >> i think they are. listen, when you get to the science, it is inherently inexact and it favors the defen...