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Either one of us would be asked to believe. and the president of the center for american progress, and former senior add vie store president obama, and alfonso agular. mimi, walk us through the law when it comes to the president's part. what league jeopardy could he be in when it comes to dangling pardons or is there jeopardy? >> if trump is using pardons to get o or trying to use his pardon power to get people to not kroop rate in the investigation, any investigation, mueller, congress, or the southern district, that is potential witness tamperring and or

Perhaps congress was wear that this investigation started. if at the end they can't find a smoking gun evidence that puts the president in a compromising position. then democrats have a problem. they keep saying that he's somehow included with the russians, if they don't find that evidence, democrats are going to -- and a lot of talking heads are going to have to do a lot of explaining to the american public. >> thank you very much. >> frank, i'm going to let you go, alfonso, jennifer and adam have to stay with me. quick programming note, former acting fbi director andrew mccabe is sitting d...

I would be alarmed by that. >> alfonso, independent numbers never seem to panic the white house, no matter what the numbers are with the middle there, self described independents. >> absolutely. and this specific move is as adam was saying directed towards his base. but let me be clear about this, i don't support the president declaring a national emergency about this, it is a bad precedent. i'm concerned a democratic president could exploit this in the future. in terms of legal authority, i think he does have it, because of the national emergency act of '76. this broad delegation of power to ...

Correctly. none of the republicans objected mifrp mcconnell, paul ryan, devin nunes. none of them was seeking to object. that didn't leak out until recently? the president's lawyers remain in the dark about it the whole time? let's get to tonight's panel, alfonso agular. jennifer palmieri, former obama and clinton communications director. and adam nigurney. frank, let me start with you you're our fbi expert here. you open that kind of investigation, what ended -- would it have surprised you, had the director of the fbi not briefed the gang of eight in congress about something as sensitive as i...

♪ the clock keeps ticking on the fiscal cliff talks, plenty of pessimism a deal can get done before christmas. we bring in our gaggle. alfonso agular. blanche, i want to start with you. do the jet fumes of national mean anything anymore? i was confident that a post-election lame duck would sort of make it a lot easier for a deal to be cut but i am -- i'm pretty pessimistic this morning. >> well, i think they know, unfortunately, that there's probably a two-week cushion after the new year of some degree. but i also think that a lot of