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Cybercapabilities, shuts down the power in ukraine, does that somehow shut down the power in eastern poland as well? >> cyberattack is again, one of those areas where we have had strategic ambiguity, but if you see american troops get hurt because the power has been shut off our polish citizens die because the hospitals go down, you're approaching a violation. >> this is important. nato secretary general also said a cyberattack could trigger article v, and that says an attack on one is an attack on all. how much does this concern you, and what can be done to prevent something like this from ha...

Operational capabilities. >> we keep hearing about article v where every member agrees it will consider an armed attack against any member state as an attack against all 30 members is an attack on one. article v has only been invoked once in the history of nato in response to the september 11th terror attacks on the united states. what scenarios do you think could trigger article v today? >> well, article v is essentially nato's commitment clause. it is effectively the alliance's formal mechanism for collective defense. it is our commitment to come to the aid of allies under attack, and really...

Threatened to walk out of nato. when he would not commit. pointedly, he took out of the speech the commitment to article v, the mutual defense pact. he wouldn't say it in brussels in front of the european leaders. he warred with the other heads of state over there, saying the eu was one of the united states' biggest rivals and used the word "foe" to describe them. of course, he was impeached over trying to blackmail ukraine over the defensive missiles they are now using, the javelins and such, to repel russian forces. we certainly know there is a long history of him cozying up to vladimir puti...

No u.s. troops on the ground in ukraine. and also that they are completely committed to article v's defense of nato. let's listen to jake as a result of jake sullivan on "meet the press" this morning. >> there are no u.s. troops operating in eastern or western ukraine. we will defend every inch of nato territory but united states forces will not engage russian forces inside ukraine. it's no surprise the russians are trying to expand the number of targets in this war because they're frustrated by their lack of ability to take some of the major cities. >> reporter: and so just on that article v ...

About putin going further. he telegraphed a lot of things with us. were we asleep? >> yes, the good news -- well, the good news -- we're only here with 44 million ukrainians fighting hard. if putin is successful and fully conquering ukraine, it's going to be a long and difficult and expensive occupation. so, i think there's breathing space in there before he can make his move. that's really important. right now, he has georgia, moldova, and the balkans, none of which were in nato and all he can do exactly what he did in ukraine and get away with that. all he has to do is find one nato state th...