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Saying this stuff but he's not saying it on cnn and not saying it outside of the kind of right-wing ecosystem means a lot of people have been able to put it to the side, to forget about it. i think there is value in everybody being reminded of it but you don't need to do it on such explicitly pro trump turf. >> i think this is actually where you and i agree. there is some brittle thornton is here about what to do about this sort of attention black hole that we've all wrestled with over eight years. there is a certain school of thought that shows up in my inbox and 20 feet of don't play him at ...

I don't agree with that. he is powerful because he says things that republicans, the republican base likes, which is where his power comes from. so i think there is an over correction in the other direction. you said that the other, day i thought it was interesting with the e. jean carroll thing. the ex president is being civilly tried for sexual abuse. feels like it should be a bigger story. >> yeah, no, it was so shocking to me when i was in the courthouse. just that it wasn't that hard to get into the courthouse. at one point, i thought i was late. i went to the media overflow room. there w...

Be less combative in the next two years? >> no, absolutely not. the point about being combative, there's a line where he says america is winning everyday and i'm thinking winning what? what is that about? we're not in a contest so i think he will continue to be just as combat iive and on the question of the wall, just coming back to semantics as a speech writer, he tried out a new phrase. it's not a wall, it's a smart strategic see through steel barrier. >> that's a little longer. >> he tested it out, it's not nice alliteration so that is an effort to move the dialogue a bit. i think every int...

President and his posture that we witnessed yesterday? >> i make what the world makes is there's going to be something new every day with president trump. it's almost like every day is something or every day is like christmas. it's a new package and a new president of something different. in this case i'm not really surprised with what president trump has done. as jeremy said before, immigration is one of these issues he goes back to. i do think that regardless of who the congress is, even if it were all democratic senate and house, he would still be pushing immigration. this is what his base ...

There is a lot of people you can make a call to the pen and start them warming up right now. amy coney barrett who is very conservative, was just confirmed last year. she is a woman. so the optics of it would be quite different and would probably be more right wing than brett kavanaugh. so what is this about? >> i think there is a practical reason and a ideological reason. the practical reason is they're afraid they won't have time to get someone through if they lose the senate. and that's perhaps realistic. the other is they love to fight when they can create an enemy, and now the enis my the...