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Giuliani's name has been used as the access point in terms of the person running the arms-for-dirt campaign rick talks about. giuliani's involvement in inescapable, and so ultimately the question ends up being will giuliani save himself and, you know, people keep on talking about the use of a presidential pardon for somebody like, i don't know, paul manafort, who i know has state charges but also somebody like roger stone. so will a presidential pardon be on the table for somebody like rudy giuliani? remember, giuliani said, "hey, i have insurance if something goes awry with something like don...

Whom he is working for for the president, you can't work both sides. >> still so many questions. rick, at the same time we are getting this new information we heard the president trying to argue giuliani was acting on his own in ukraine without his blessing. is that story believable? >> no. look, since i'm the opinionator here, this is an arms for dirt deal. it has been from the beginning. anybody with a luck of common sense can see that. it was orchestrated by rudy colludie. you have to work for the president because he either doesn't pay or you have to hire a lawyer to defend yourself, it wi...

There's no value add to what he does. the real turkey this year is rudy giuliani. we talk about hired guns, but he is a gun with blanks. the guy doesn't really deliver what he is supposed to do and he is desperate for money. because of that, you know, he will be selling america to the highest bidder, and i guess at this point in time it was the ukrainian government. >> rick, do you see the potential that any of this moves the needle in terms of what republicans think of impeachment? certainly the information we've had so far doesn't seem to have. >> it is hard to say they haven't moved now. al...