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Which brings us back to this weekend's rallies and the fight to defend obamacare, something that has seemed to unify all the various wings of the democratic party and indeed the broader center-left. the rally in michigan with bernie sanders there appearing alongside chuck schumer, senator gary peters and gary stabenow. she's a democrat from michigan. the politics of this are fascinating because we all saw what happened in reverse seven years ago, eight years ago during the affordable care act. is the goal of democrats to essentially reverse engineer their own version of that kind of citizen pr...

Sean spicer, to come out and say, trump's goal is to get access to health care, not necessarily make sure everyone has insurance. which brings us back to this weekend's rallies and the fight to defend obamacare, something that has seemed to unify all the various wings of the democratic party and indeed the broader center-left. the rally in michigan with bernie sanders there appearing alongside chuck schumer, senator gary peters and gary stabenow. she's a democrat from michigan. the politics of this are fascinating because we all saw what happened in reverse seven years ago, eight years ago dur...

Examples where you say an outside game really mattered. >> well, thank you very much. yes, i think the anti-apartheid ridges las vegas strug is a great example of where pressure from the grassroots brought about profound action in washington. it's also an example as i explore in my book of where sometimes you need to learn to take half a loaf and you can actually make a lot of progress. the other example is one where we lost. we lost consistently in battles with ronald reagan to curb the growing arsenal. at one time we had 60,000 nuclear weapons, but we ended up winning a war because ultimatel...

Hurdle in the senate, which is why he's been trying to negotiate with the republicans. how can he get there? >> that's the way you look at it as an insider. >> that's the hack speaking. now citizen. >> what the citizens have to do is, people of maine and connecticut, these are the three -- these are the three votes, these people need to do what's right for the american people. and so there needs to be huge citizen pressure on the two senators in maine, the rogue senator in connecticut, and that's how we're going to have that -- but again we're back playing by their rules, talking about 60 vote...

How can he get there? from where he's standing now? >> that's the way you look at it as an insider. >> >> that's the hack speaking. >> no, no, now citizens, what the citizens have to do is, people of maine and connecticut, these are the three -- these are the three votes, these people need to do what's right for the american people. and so there needs to be huge citizen pressure on the two senators in maine, the rogue senator in connecticut, and that's how we're going to have that -- but again we're back playing by their rules, talking about 60 votes. it's 50. 50 plus the vice president of the...