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Keel as. he is an associate of a think tank. good to have you with us. president trump and his lawyers will not participate in wednesday's impeachment hearings, insisting the process at least is unfair. are they right or wrong on that point, and how much of this is about trying to avoid legitim e legitimizing the impeachment process? >> i think it's entirely about trying to avoid legitimizing the impeachment process. there's been a calculation throughout while the narrative around the president certainly changes as more facts have come out, there has been an overarching strategy behind the whi...

Under the current circumstances, we do not intend to participate in your wednesday hearing. this had put the white house in a tough spot because of course administration officials and trump allies have complained throughout this process that they have perceived it as unfair. but sending a lawyer to those hearings on wednesday could have been lending an air of legitimacy to proceedings that trump and his allies have decried as a sham throughout this process. interestingly, cipollone did leave the door open for the white house participating in future hearings. cipollone writing, we may consider ...

Strategy. so the question of whether it's legitimate is a little bit beside the point because all of this stems from a desire to throw up as many roadblocks to the process as possible. that's why they blocked off everyone from don mcgahn to john bolton from testifying. it's why they have thrown up numerous lawsuits and legal challenges designed to delay and distract and hold on to the idea that assuming that the republicans stick together as a bloc, the entire thing will fall into the sort of predictable partisan character that even if you have majority support for impeachment, it won't cascad...

There's been a significant volume of legal scholarship about it. i mean as a matter of ordinary law rather than constitutional law, the process of seeking to use an official act in order to gain something of value is specifically prohibited by federal election law, and i think the attempt to withdraw military and political aid from ukraine in exchange for an investigation into a political rival would by most standards be considered a violation of that law. but that's not the fundamental question here. it's a political question of how the house judiciary defines it and what the implications of ...

Smaller than had the impeachment hearings not been going on because the proceeding in congress encouraged trump supporters to get out there and vote against the democratic nominee for governor. they still won in both of the states but that is why you hear -- part of the reason why democrats are eager to move this process and quickly and get it done as far before the 2020 election. >> and for democrats maybe in the rearview mirror by november 2020. >> right. >> margaret. >> i'll be watching president trump's trip to nato this week. it is a short trip but a lot of crazy things could happen in a ...