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Manafort? tom barack. a guy work for free do you want to take him in the president said i'm losing these delegates to ted cruz. even though i won the primary is he winning over my delegates. manafort will work for free. he wants to get back to america. everything dried up over there since the ukrainian government went anti-russian. is he looking to come over here and reestablish himself. that casual conversation turned into manafort which turned into maybe the bulk of the collusion case which may not exist. especially if you listen to what the judge says jason chaffetz the house oversight and ...

President, that they're not actually after getting manafort on money laundering and those charges. how much does this muddy the waters? >> depends where judge ellis ends up, obviously. there's obvious validity to it, they were trying to flip manafort. did not start out as something looking into manafort's finances, whether he committed bank fraud, if me violated foreign lobbying laws. that being said, mueller does have, if you look at his -- the special counsel's dictum, whatever you want to call it, he has a fair amount of purview and can do these things. ellis apparently has a reputation for...

Mean? it's like a therapist in a room with a client. they don't sound -- they are trying to get into the mind of the president, and that's a dangerous place to be for a number of reasons, especially when you're trying to prosecute these thought crimes, process crimes, like perjury or objection. look at the collusion case. it's about the meeting at trump tower. remember, this lawyer comes in, says she has dirt on hillary, she ends up having nothing and wants to discuss adoption. they kicked her out of trump tower in 15 minutes. but guess what, right before she goes into trump tower, she meets w...

Client is don't take about these things publicly. he can't help himself minute by minute let alone month by month. >> his hands have to be huge. his crowds have to be huge. it's almost like huge is his word. the answer will be huge. you go, but i just think it's -- to me it's an open and sut case. in the sense that in a nonlegal case, he wanted the russians to help him beat hillary and he said so. >> i mean. >> he said it on national television. hack. >> well, and i think that's why mule irwants to talk to him directly because a big key of obstruction is intention. and trying to prove the inte...

Rule in the summer zervos lawsuit against him for defamation as well that he actually has to face those allegations, even though he is taking that up on appeal. but a prior united states supreme court decision, chris, has said that a sitting president, a la bill clinton, can be sued and does not have immunity from that type of lawsuit. >> let me go to robert on this one. i know you've got some breaking story. i want to ask you about one thing before that this idea of gowdy, trey gowdy, it seems like republicans on their way out of congress become very independent. they really stand apart. i'm ...