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Instead, it will be an in-close knife fight.

Week, in some cases even every year. >> yeah, i mean, the other issue here is the sort of moral substantive strategic question about taking out someone's grid which seems to me an extreme escalation that i really hope that no one -- no one is considering. >> well, it's an extreme escalation against a civilian target. >> right. >> this is not going after moscow's nuclear arsenal. this is not going after their command and control structures. the power grid is an inherently cinch structure. >> yeah. >> and that's the problem with cyber warfare. look, in conventional war, you respond with conventi...

Which seems to me an extreme escalation that i really hope that no one -- no one is considering. >> well, it's an extreme escalation against a civilian target. >> right. >> this is not going after moscow's nuclear arsenal. this is not going after their command and control structures. the power grid is an inherently cinch structure. >> yeah. >> and that's the problem with cyber warfare. look, in conventional war, you respond with conventional means. in nuclear war doctrine prescribes you respond with nuclear means. in cyber it's much more difficult because attribution is not a given and there i...

Cases, have special capabilities that the united states doesn't have. in the event we have to fight that war, were not going to be disadvantaged. but here's the key thing. china wants to avoid conflict with united states so they have developed what i am calling operations to conduct operations below the level of conflict that will get them the same results that conflict would get which is what geopolitical control and influence. south china sea, east china sea, areas around japan and taiwan are all about intimidation, collusion, undermining civil society, undermining government, taking over me...

Services that were working for president obama. they militarized the south china sea which is half the economy that passes through. in a time of conflict or unrest, they want to have control. 62% of their oil comes out of the middle east. they know the united states carry a battle group that could tie that up in terms of confrontation. it's the achilles heel of china. that is why the port exists and why they're building another one near the indian ocean. want to have economic influence initially that will give them geopolitical influence and ultimately control. >> what you are suggesting here ...