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Base. >> neil: you know what is a final epithet, the friends of brett kavanaugh from high school had to write a letter clarifying the meaning of the term "devil's triangle" and with us not a sexual reference. i thought that was a metaphor for this entire thing. >> that sounds about right. you know, the rhetoric and the things that u.s. senators are discussing in public hearings, i can't say we've seen anything like this in recent times. maybe it goes back to the clintons, describing the affair that. bill clinton had. this is another level of -- and while you can argue both sides are trying to ...

I think what was shocking to me was getting up under oath and with a straight face saying that these things were true when he knew and when a lot of people knew that that was not the case and it was a suggestion that if i just say this nobody will challenge me, that nobody will stand up and take the risk of saying what we all knew to be true. and i think what really got under my skin with this was that really we weren't talking about brett's drinking, and we weren't talking about his saying bad things about women. we were talking about what i believed to be the credible claims of women that ha...

Memory of brett was he was on the far edge of this. he was notably heavier in drinking than other people. it was a long time ago. i can't say he was drunk in this state or not. i can tell you my recollection of my experience with him was that he was drunk frequently and it wasn't drunk to the point of having trouble getting up every month or two. it was frequently. i would say with some confidence at least once or twice on the weekends. maybe during the week. >> the important thing there that roche also said that was kavanaugh lied under oath about never having blacked out or failing to rememb...

Throwing, then the devils triangle. whenever you tried to accuse somebody of something, it was couched in safety language. i didn't see it happen but i heard about it from somebody else. then when the fbi chases it down, there's absolutely nothing there. like flimsy structures in a really bad country, they fall apart at the strongest wind. the other lesson, you have to ask why some people kept their heads down during this, even of the claims became more ludicrous. why didn't anybody share the risk? i include republicans. they were afraid that if they raised their head, they would get hit too. ...

Suggesting something else. usually takes something of pretty sensitive nature for them to redact something. >> you know, i thought a lot about it. i can't think of anything. you know, again, it's a very long time ago. it's possible that i'm forgetting something but nothing comes to mind. >> okay. so whatever issues he's talking about, you're not sure. you also said that when judge kavanaugh was asked under oath about certain terms in his yearbook, boofing and devil's triangle, he said those were about flatulence and devil's triangle is a drinking game. you say -- that's been disputed by other ...