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Getting president trump out of office and i think that's what's going to sustain him going through this. he does have to have a better debate performance than he had last time because he really got dinged up by senator harris, but he has that strong lead because i think he's seen as a good matchup against the president. >> quickly before we go, you look at that ohio poll, and there is something of a conventional wisdom among both republicans and democrats that ohio is less a swing state today and more a reliable red state. i wonder when you look at those numbers, biden's lead there, does that ...

As if you speak to no one. there's actually two and a half or three. >> i'm going to write them down on a piece of paper and we'll see how this goes. don't peek. >> in a poll yesterday, joe biden is up by ten points and everybody else is within the margin of error. with these candidates just starting off at their best without being dinged up, still within the margin of error, i will be the the first to admit, and i wrote it in "the washington post" about a month ago, the democratic nomination was going to be more important than ever before because you'd just be a step away from the

Donald trump, stop the reversal of what we have been able to accomplish during the obama presidency. >> but you know, just one of these numbers, you've got sanders beating trump 51% to 38% in iowa. you could make the argument that he hasn't had as much scrutiny but that she has more baggage, that she's dinged up. >> well, you know, i think the question is what's going to happen 300 days from now when people really look at that. i think that the truth is that she has stood up and been able to fight back against the republican charges against her, and that she is an extremely strong general elec...

Gore's campaign thought he spoiled. you have ross perot who dinged up george hw bush and george wallace ran as a democrat and often, it hurt democratic party nominees. . >> i don't think trump is going to like it when you call him spoiler. >> no. no. don't put me in that box. i get enough mail from the trump folks. i don't say he's a spoiler. >> before we go, summer is a great time to catch up on reading. you might want to check out bill's killing books, including hitl hitler's last days. if you become a premium member, you can get any book for free including killing reagan, out september 22nd...

Spoiled. you have ross perot who dinged up george hw bush and george wallace ran as a democrat and often, it hurt democratic party nominees. . >> i don't think trump is going to like it when you call him spoiler. >> no. no. don't put me in that box. i get enough mail from the trump folks. i don't say he's a spoiler. >> before we go, summer is a great time to catch up on reading. you might want to check out bill's killing books, including hitl hitler's last days. if you become a premium member, you can get any book for free including killing reagan, out september 22nd. that is it for us tonight...