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Growing up. you know, we all -- and that doesn't mean you're not principled and you're not focussed on driving around a particular position or a particular issue. it means that you're sort of pushing the boulder up the hill and you get it a certain way, and other people are pushing it. sometimes it's going to slip back, right? >> joining me now is frank rich, writer at large for "new york magazine." frank, that sounded like a pretty good tutorial on the politics of governing. >> i agree, i think he's entirely right on that. the problem he has now in this protacted negotiations with these intra...

To maintain the union. well, the huffington post would have reported on that, right? i mean, it would have been blistering, right? i mean think about it. lincoln sells out slaves. right? there would be protests and a lot of third party guys, and so i think as you guys talk to your friends about getting involved civically, don't set up a situation where you're guaranteed to be disappointed. that's part of the process of growing up. you know, we all -- and that doesn't mean you're not principled and you're not focussed on driving around a particular position or a particular issue. it means that ...

Guaranteed to be disappointed. that's part of the process of growing up. we all -- and that doesn't mean you're not principled or focused on or driving around a particular position or a particular issue. it means that you're sort of pushing the boulder up the hill, and you get it to circle him. other people are pushing. sometimes it's going to slip back. right? >> joining me now is frank rich, writer at large for "new york" magazine. that sounded like a pretty good tutor yal? >> i agree. i think he's entirely right about that. the problem i think he has now is in this pro tracted negotiation w...

Majority, you don't get it if you're in the minority, and you can -- you can be honorable in politics, understanding that you're not going to get 100% of what you want. and that's been our history. you think about -- you think about our greatest presidents, and the abraham lincoln, here's a guy who didn't believe in slavery, but his first priority was keeping the union. i have the emancipation proclamation hanging up in my office, and if you read through it, turns out that most of it -- a guy who didn't believe in slavery, but his first priority was keeping the union. i have the emancipation p...