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Know, off the record about, you know, the number one -- enemy number one in many cases is not barack obama, not hillary clinton. enemy number one is essentially who people perceive as the leaders of the republican party. >> yeah. >> the republican establishment. and you know, we've been talking this whole time about the race is ultimately going to have to come down to establishment, anti-establishment, two-person race. but if that's the dynamic, i don't see how the person who wins that establishment slot has a shot unless the dynamic shifts. >> well, the dynamic has to shift in a way that we h...

Race. but if that's the dynamic, i don't see how the person who wins that establishment slot has a shot unless the dynamic shifts. >> well, the dynamic has to shift in a way that we haven't seen right now. look, since -- for seven months, chris, trump has held this poll position, this number one spot. and yeah, he may lose iowa. but i'm not even banking fully on that at this point. as we know, iowa can be a little fickle. everyone's concerned about turnout. but trump has got an organization there. he's playing hard in new hampshire. as jess just said, when the focus turns to the south, that's ...

Know, the number one -- enemy number one in many cases is not barack obama, not hillary clinton, enemy number one is essentially who people perceive as the leaders of the republican party. >> yeah. >> the republican establishment. and you know, we've been talking this whole time about the race is ultimately going to have to come down to establishment, anti-establishment, two-person race. but if that's the dynamic, i don't see how the person who wins that establishment slot has a shot unless the dynamic shifts. >> well, the dynamic has to shift in a way that we haven't seen right now. look, sin...

Bush, which he says i shouldn't even be talking about this guy because he's at 2% in the polls and spends ten minutes running him down to talk about how low energy he is. >> that is a very good point. we have seen him do that with a couple different candidates. kasie, i want to give you the final question, which draws upon the point that chris is making. we're starting to see this in-fighting within the gop, with marco rubio, with jeb bush, with chris christie over, you know, they are attacking marco rubio per not having voted enough in the senate. attacking jeb bush for not showing up in new ...

Same tomorrow night? >> well, i think that the best performances we have seen -- look, trump wins the debates because he doesn't lose them to the voter. he may to the press but he doesn't to the people who are for him. near has carson but he has now some special problems. but you have had rubio, cruz, and fiorina have stood out. christie stood out in the last debut a but will be on the first debate. those were the candidates who had moments where they have gained. i think everybody is looking at rubio. everyone thinks rubio and to a lesser extent cruz for the establishment slot, if you will. b...