It's more important, certainly since ronald reagan, that they have a real rock-ribbed conservative republican and that's the best contrast and the best way to advance the republican values. >> shannon: you also had head-to-head debate with two former governor, two former party leader, i don't think they agreed on anything. >> no. this was a gamble on our part. we wanted to preview what the general election debate will be like, whether it's romney or not, against obama. we had howard dean, the former democratic party chair and halley barber, the republican party chair. you heard a lot of attack...