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I guess there's no rule book for this, and i guess they go along and get along. the bigger question is has joe biden yet been able to convert into electability i'm the guy that ukraine is about? >> no, i don't think so. i think he missed the original opportunity. when the story first broke there was a moment, right, when he could come out and go on offense. he chose not to do that. and because of that i think that's a missed opportunity that he can't get back. so now we're in a moment he's actually late coming to the impeachment train. you had elizabeth warren, julian castro and others coming ...

He chose not to do that. and because of that i think that's ae missed opportunity th hese can't get back. so now we're in a moment he's actually late coming to the impeachment train. you had elizabeth warren, julian castro and others coming out immediately we needer to impeach this president. in some ways he's playing s catch-up. i think in this moment this is actually good for him, though. this means he's not going to be under the same media scrutiny which is good because he won't have the uncle joe moments and some gaffes. but also the second tier candidates are always going s to be fighting...

For the proceedings to happen. if that is the case after november 22nd, the government shuts down, how do they compete? >> harris: that is such a fantasy for democrats, though. because then can say, "the president try to stop them," so on and so forth. >> leslie: maybe he's luring them. >> harris: now they can call witnesses and defend him... >> melissa: i don't think he wants this to stop. i think he likes impeachment train. judging by the ruler he gets from the crowd when he talks about it, i think he thinks this works for him. especially if it gets out in public. what has not been working, ...

Issues americans are concerned with. certainly jobs and the economy. like it or not, the impeachment train is rolling down the tracks no matter what they do about it. >> if they don't have this wrapped up by the end of the year, at what point do the democrats possibly start considering abandoning that and looking at 2020? do they do that? >> i don't think they do, christi. the reality is this. unlike the mueller probe where we had this long period of time where no one knew what was going on, with impeachment what we're seeing is by the nature of having all these witnesses and these depositions...

Truly -- what we suddenly learn about and we don't have any of that. we have a different style of a presidency, a let's make a deal kind of presidency. and that's who we have. and i just don't see any of this rising to the level of impeachability and i wish we could get off the impeachment train. neil: we'll see what happens. ken starr, thank you very, very much. >> my pleasure. neil: the turkish president erdogan is saying this morning he will indeed put troops into syria if the deal with the united states-- and whatever deal he made with the vice-president and secretary of state when they vi...