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And a half hours. it was obvious that was going to be the news because there were about ten minutes out of two hours where there was some sharp exchanges. but the bulk of the conversation, which is there to kind of lay a groundwork for the history that's going to be written, was pretty cordial. there were campaigns talking about each side about what they were doing and what they were thinking at various stages. that's what goes on at harvard. >> it seemed, though, that clip we played -- and i know there was other stuff discussed. jim palmieri's point was that you guys didn't run an honorable c...

Jersey residents love but might not play in the same way across the country? >> well, the chairman of the republican or democratic governors association, it's really more of a mechanical job, not a spokesman job. so it's going to be -- it would give him an opportunity to meet with the republican party's biggest donors around the country and to sort of lay a groundwork should he run for president. but as a -- you know, it's not really that high a visibility a job. so -- and each of these states, the governors races, they're not about him. they're about whoever the republican nominee for governo...