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The emergency declaration, which would be enough to overturn it along with democratic votes, though not yet enough for a vetoproof majority. it is widely expected that the president will veto that resolution. let's bring in my panel, kimberly atkins, senior washington correspondent for npr and an msnbc contributor. kevin serilli, bloomberg news chief washington correspondent. and nick achorman here in studio, former assistant special watergate prosecutor and msnbc legal analyst. kimberly, let me begin with you. let's talk about this setback. how big of, how significant of a setback is this for...

Media indictment where the russians used social media to suppress -- microtarget voters and suppress the hillary clinton vote and the break-in to the democratic national committee. i think there's not going to be a major mueller report as such. it's really going to be one indictment at a time. and this is exactly what happened during the watergate era. everybody was divided. public opinion was divided. but once major indictments came down indicting the president's attorney general, his two top aides, and a whole series of other top aides in the administration, the whole atmosphere changed. and...

Russia investigation and it's really ultimately going to come down to the mueller investigation once it does conclude, does wrap up for folks to be able to look at this. i would just lastly quickly make one point, which is that president trump addressing cpac last night, that was classic campaign-style donald it up. i went to countless political candidate rallies for then candidate donald trump during the first presidential cycle and i can tell you it was a marathon last night. he took an ax, a political ax, so to speak, and bulldozed his way through it. that from my point of view was the offi...

Offenses like that that are not crimes? >> oh, sure. crimes and impeachable offenses are two different things. we have to lay out for the american people, and we can't depend on the mueller investigation for this. the mueller investigation, number one, we don't know when it's ending despite lots of rumors. number two, it's focused on specific crimes. and we have to focus much more broadly. on abuses of power. >> nick, what's your take on? what are some examples of abuses of power that may not necessarily be crimes but at the same time can be impeachable offenses? >> there are lots of things it...

The lawsuits, led of course by california, i think that might pose more of a risk to the president right now than republicans having enough votes to override his veedo. >> thank you, kevin, for teeing up the question about the courts. do you think, nick, that the only way to challenge this in a meaningful way and not just symbolically, will it be the courts who make the definitive definition? >> it very well may be that the courts make the definitive decision here. you've got that case with harry truman during the korean war trying to take over the steel plants. i think there's good precedent ...