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We don't want to open the door to parties trying to get presidents out of there because they're really, really bad at their job or have done bad things. that really is what the impeachment process is for. i want to go back for just a second, though, to the commission. i think people are confusing what the commission does with regard to donald trump and obstruction of justice and what they do for russia. an independent commission would be very helpful in the russia investigation, because we do need some prescriptions going forward. that's what the 9/11 commission did. they looked at all of the ...

Their job or have done bad things. that really is what the impeachment process is for. i want to go back for just a second, though, to the commission. i think people are confusing what the commission does with regard to donald trump and obstruction of justice and what they do for russia. an independent commission would be very helpful in the russia investigation, because we do need some prescriptions going forward. that's what the 9/11 commission did. they looked at all of the facts, looked how all the mechanisms of our national security team did not work properly and they made recommendations...

Looks at as part of its constitutional oversight function and we're not there yet. but the larger questions here that also come in the questions you were asking, nicolle, about a potential cover-up, is, you have the underlying counterintel question, what happened during the campaign, then you have questions about the transition period and financial questions. and then now you have this third layer in this layered cake about whether there are attempts to impede or obstruct. so the cover-up would be of the original crimes then keep in mind that could be separate from whether there's an obstructi...

Forthcoming. so one defense that trump seems to be trying to allege is that this conversation never happened. again, i don't think there's any reason to believe that that's true. if that's all trump has to hang on to, he's in deep trouble. >> ari, is he in deep trouble from a legal standpoint if it turns out what comey recorded in his memos is true, that he was asked to drop the flynn case and said flynn is a really good guy? >> yes. the basic issue here is not what's in the memo, alone. it's what's in the memo combined with everything else including this unusual termination of the fbi directo...

Least for the russia inquiry. number one, how can the fbi prove again to the american public that this investigation will continue without any bullying or any other interference from the president? and number two, does the fbi or the justice department need to issue some kind of formal limits or guidance on the president's interactions with the current acting and future fbi director, given everything that has gone down? joining me now, jim cavanaugh. he is of course an msnbc enforcement analyst, retired atf agent with a lot of experience, and as promised, back with us prosecutor joyce vance. j...