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Of ieds and barriers for the follow-on forces of the iraqi military to come in there, retake it. it will happen, and it will happen over time. but the real message is to the citizens of ramadi. can they have confidence in the iraqi military that it will be held, that the military won't go anywhere, and that they can then begin to achieve some degree of normalcy which they clearly have not with an occupation force of isis over the course of the last six months. >> absolutely not. and i think there is a very huge lingering question of okay, say they take it. what's next? i mean, you say that isi...

>> no. because we need a coordinated effort for this to work. america knows that what happens when you go all alone in a country and your liberation force are seen as occupation force and this doesn't turn out very well. it needs to be coordinated, especially the arab countries in the area, also in the e area. we need to have an agreement with russia and iran about what the transition should be in regards to assad. >> do you believe after an attack like this there can be appetite in france for more of a ground force in a country like syria or in a country like iraq, in coordination with allies...

>> how is special ops play a role. they'm conducted a raid. how do you want to see us fight this with special operations? >> well, it's bigger than special operations but just dealing with that issue we very successfully in iraq and afghanistan, particularly during the surge in both countries conducted eight to ten of these operations a night. in fact when win took osama bin laden down there was agent going down that night in afghanistan. and that's one way to put significant pressure on the leaders. other things we can do with special operations. we can take larger fors, like the rangers and ...

Warplanes, and that the fact is somebody's going to have to get down on the ground if they are serious about stopping the bloodshed. is that a step the u.n. and the u.s. is willing to take? >> will, at this stage, the answer is no. if you look at the text of the u.n. resolution 1973 which authorizes the current air actions, it explicitly bars foreign military forces as an occupation force and the sorts of operations that i think you're hinting at right now are barred by what the u.n. resolution is talking about. and i actually think if you look at the obama administration's posture, they don't...

Rubble. the question is what comes after you control the skies? >> john: winning the military campaign is easy. but as we learned in iraq winning the peace is much tougher. >> it could be a big problem here because as we saw in afghanistan and iraq. you win the military campaign and then bad people flood in to take advantage of that and how do you deal with that? you walk away and have another afghanistan? one thing they did not authorize is an occupation force which guarantee that there would not be chaos. >> john: defense secretary gates seemed to be throwing a lot of cold water on the idea ...