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And i want to talk about the pardon question. the public testimony you watch would the rest of us, private testimony you can't speak about, what dounderstand that you didn't before? >> i saw a person who ran a business, who ran his personal life a campaign, a transition and an administration and a very corrupt way. i was hoping to hear -- because he is the president of the united states, that you would hear redeeming qualities about him. that he wanted to make lives better, an honest person. and after hearing from michael cohen in private over 24 hours over the last two years, i saw

Said about this not being about collusion and trying to take it as a clean bill of health. we know this trial was never meant whether or not to litigate, whether or not that was collusion between the trump campaign and the russians. this was about criminal activity paul manafort was engaged in extra from the collusion question. the president sort of shaded the lines there. and then on the pardon question, i didn't hear the pardon question precisely. i don't know if it has specifically to do with manafort or was it manafort and cohen? the president took an opportunity to talk about how it's mic...

Context? but i do think if you went to a jury, a jury would understand this isn't a mob boss. this isn't a drug dealer. this isn't, you know, this is the president of the united states who can pardon everybody that's being investigated in this case. that takes it to a whole different level, and i think the jury would acknowledge that. >> robert costa, you've talked to all of the players. where does this story go next? who is still pressing on them? is it congress, is it the conversations in the southern district of new york? we played the sound of michael cohen talking about some of these conv...

There are reports from other news outlets that giuliani was back at the white house today. take a listen on this pardon question to how the president discussed it regarding paul manafort earlier. >> one of the reasons i respect paul manafort so much is he went through that trial -- >> are you considering pardoning paul manafort? >> i have great respect for what he's done in terms of what he's gone through. you know, he worked for ronald reagan for years. he worked for bob dole. i would say what he did, some of the charges they threw against him, every consultant, every lobbyist in washington p...

Upon that. the president's lawyer and tv spokesman often is coming out with a new tweet today where he says never means never, not even after july 2nd, 2018, which is the latest deception, another perjury and more prison. trying to discredit cohen further, it plays into the president's argument that cohen cannot be trusted. and, therefore, even in his sort of finding truth moment where he's gone on capitol hill in a series of different appearances bri bringing documents, bringing his story, they are finding this big hole they claim of a pardon question and whether cohen wanted it, didn't want ...