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Information firsthand. all the information that i have, and i think most of us have, comes from an article that dr. ford gave that ult ready from an interview she gave in the "washington post." i'm not criticizing the "washington post," but i need to hear from dr. ford firsthand. point two, staff, both minority and majority staff for senate committees investigate allegations, alleged facts, all the time. we don't normally go to the fbi. we have a very good and not inexpensive majority staff and minority staff that are investigating all of these claims right now. now, senator feinstein has inst...

We've seen conspiracy theories coming out, the "wall street journal" saying she misremembered. that is point one. point two, the republicans had the same problem in anita hill they need a theory and because there is a categorical deny from judge kavanaugh, he is not saying i blacked out and maybe things went too far or any of that. to so -- so it can't be dismissed as something that happens when you were 17. and not even saying i have remorse or different character. he's saying it did not happen. so that forces them into the position you just saw orrin hatch take that she believes what she's s...

Is you have to go back a little bit and look at the history of this. my father francis schaefer in the 1970s and '80s and me with his nep tiftic side started the pro-life movement with the series called whatever happened to the human race and to the present time i think the evangelical voter has become two things, first of all, driven mad by the issue of abortion and so much of an obsession, that they would do anything, including sanctifying a guy like roy moore, an alleged pedophile and an alleged attempted rapist, so that is point one. point two, the evangelical group itself has moved so far...

Whatever the motive may be. but we don't see that in this particular article. and so i can't imagine why the department of justice would open an investigation. there just isn't a crime opinion that's point one. point two, i think it's reprehensible for any chief executive to be using the department of justice to sort of ferret out the identity of somebody exercising first amendment rights. it is not his playground. it's not his toy. it is the department of justice and they should be used to investigate legitimate crime. not to sort of fulfill his vendettas. >> the point here is we'll never kno...

Indispensable, and therefore i'm going to remain anonymous, but at the same time, i'm going to criticize my boss. even if it's justified, and i don't know whether it's justified or not. >> fair point. i get the having it both ways point. fair point. how about how the president is handling this? if it is a nothing-burger, way make so much ado about something that doesn't matter? having these people come forward, these apparent loyalty tests, you know, trying to do everything they can to unearth who is anonymous. why if it doesn't matter? if you don't think it's real, why treat it this way? >> i...