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And away from the scrutiny of the public eye. it is a process argument that ignores the damning substance of that private testimony. the president, though, praising the disruptors as tough, smart and understanding. but not all republicans are comfortable with this stunt. republican congressman franklin rudy, for example, sharing a little advice for both sides. >> part fortunaof the reason i' really cut out for this work is i'm not really theatrical. >> what would be your advice to the democrats? >> as soon as they go public and have a more spirited public debate about this would probably be in...

Lindsay graham who we just showed he defended this process in the past, do you buy it's an issue with the process or do you think he's trying to make this witness look untrustworthy? >> i think the process argument is a distraction and is phony. what is at question here is the substance of the president's actions. >> did he act and did he abuse the power he has as president in not giving the 391 million to the ukraine and russia. we know it is headed by putin and we don't know if the president or putin have talked about this and russia has been advantaged by what happened in turkey. so i think...

Hearings secret? >> you do with the republicans did yesterday because you're trying to distract from investor bill taylor's testimony of the day before. they can't argue the facts we try to make a process argument and i had to go to great lengths to do it. i personally don't think the most effective way to try to defend donald trump and others from breaking federal crimes is to commit federal crimes which is what happen when into the secure area yesterday with phones and put our national security at risk. everything a member of congress who went in there with the phone committed a federal crim...

Department, but members of the armed service committee were not in there. they don't have access to the transcripts. this is a deposition, so the democrats argued that all depositions are handled this way. but the overarching argument against that is that this is about the impeachment of the president of the united states. so you pull back the scope and look at it and say, why should this be open to the press? why should it be open to the public? that is a case that republicans are making in the opening getting increasingly upset as the witnesses go without any of them hearing it. >> bret: wha...

The moderate republicans even now are still holding back on saying that this is bad and that they believe that this is something that is impeachable. so to the congressman's point and to your point, chuck, it's going to be really important how it is laid out. and that is why the democrats are doing this different than they did the mueller debacle, which is to have these closed-door hearings to gather all of the evidence because they are constitutionally charged with bringing the charges forward. and then present it in open hearings. and then that is the time that we, the media, do our job and ...