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Serious. doesn't mean he's not going to be punished, but again as dan pointed out, this is supposed to be a counterintelligence investigation. and the crimes that they're unearthing are crimes that occurred after the investigation started. paul: but let me push back on you guys at this point. julian assange we know, from his previous experience, is anti-american. he hates america, he has been responsible for tangible harm to american national security. why in the world would anyone if associated with the trump campaign want to have anything to do with julian assange? and isn't that sleazy beha...

To launch a dilating and improper and illegitimate investigation of donald trump and now his long-time friend and ally robert mueller is pretty much doing the same. these are process crimes. but out indictment of roger stone only shows today that mueller has failed to meet his mandate. no one has been charged with a crime for which mueller was appointed. >> sean: you know, professor dershowitz, you talk about the criminalizing of political differences here. every one of those people i mentioned and gregg just mentioned are guilty of the exact same thing that they charged roger stone with. if w...

It appears to me that that was based on -- that suspicion was primarily based on the steele dossier which has not been verified and what you have at the end as you point out is a bunch of process crimes, people who lied to investigators, who were investigating something that wasn't a crime. neil: all right. it's confusing to me. thank you very much. andrew mccarthy. >> glad i was able to clear that up. neil: you do, all the time. i appreciate that. we are going to go right now to mike pompeo, secretary of state, who just wrapped up a u.n. security council meeting on what's going on in venezuel...

>> stone is obviously out on bail, a $250,000 bond to be exact. his next court date is b january 29th in the nation's capital. it's not uncommon for the fbi to make early morningg arrests of targets who are under indictment, but it's first time robert mueller has used this tactic. stone had been predicting his indictment for months. sean, back to you. >> sean: trace, thank you. we are witnessing the>> biggest abuse of power scandal in modern american history. it's playing out right before your eyes. more corruption than we have ever seen. really, a predawn raid? 17 vehicles move in. 27 fbi age...

The fbi cause to do a search warrant in the morning, incident to arrest, which would be something obviously inconsistent with a voluntary surrender. so, that's why what was done was done. there's no escaping the fact, i don't want to give excuses for violating the law and making false statements under oath, lying to congress, obstruction of justice and again these are process crimes. while there's obviously a concern about what it is he was lying about, the argument from the democrats that, well, these are all the friends that the president associates himself with is a little akin to saying th...