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And deep automatic spending cuts take effect. economists say that could send us right into another recession. mike emmanuel live on capitol hill. hello, mike. >> shep, congressional sources say talks have been business like and productive and almost everybody realizes they're going to have to give a little to get this done. several senators mentioned entitlement reform when i asked about where to cut. >> reform doesn't mean you throw these programs out. you run them more efficiently. you look at the fraud or waste and abuse that's been identified and then you come into the revenue picture. you...

And has been a clip on "saturday night live," that big bird is a silly attack line but what he was saying, look, this is an area where i don't see a high priority to borrow money from china to support this. >>guest: the media says be specific, be specific, about law are cutting and what loopholes to get rid of, and the one program he mentioned there has been a week, now, of attention on this program. it is a very good example, neil, of why it is so hard to cut the federal budget. when you talk about single programs, gingrich learned this less monday in 1995 when i worked for him and we tried t...

Is that he voted for every single thing that blew open the budget deficit under george w. bush. voted for the tax cuts, obviously. then he voted for completely unfunded provision, the expansion of medicare prescription drugs. so he built this deficit, just as much as george w. bush did. >> and he voted for t.a.r.p. which i love to remind people, john boehner wept on the floor of the house, begging republicans to vote for. and he did vote for it. so, yeah, the guy did -- that he's a fiscal conservative is kind of ridiculous when you look at his voting record. but i think paul ryan, because he's...

Unfunded provision, the expansion of medicare prescription drugs. so he built this deficit, just as much as george w. bush did. >> and he voted for t.a.r.p. which i love to remind people, john boehner wept on the floor of the house, begging republicans to vote for. and he did vote for it. so, yeah, the guy did -- that he's a fiscal conservative is kind of ridiculous when you look at his voting record. but i think paul ryan, because he's a rich kid in part, is the triumph of ideology when you know that the consequences will never fall on you or yours. it's easy to say, people should just get us...

This is not a sports scandal. this is one of the worst scandals in modern history. i think it approaches the catholic church, certainly not in dimension, but think about it. and michael is right. that 1998 investigation, they have sandusky admitting -- admitting that he did something inappropriate with a child! he admits it! there is a detective hiding in the house who hears it. and they do not press charges? and then he retires in 1999? and apparently he was rumored for other jobs, and i know these clubhouses and locker rooms. they're cliquish, they gossip, they talk all the time, and i'm con...