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For the simple reason that these two countries, while they have an interest in overlapping interest in opposing us and creating a world that is safe for their autocracy and thuggery and corruption, et cetera, in the end they're more worried about each other. and document or no document, when the russians look south, they see a problem. and when the chinese look north, they see an opportunity. and you know, we could see this as a propaganda document. this is joining the propaganda together. but they're always going to be frenemies and because of the way i think about it is two mafia families. t...

One is surprised the first time, most of it is this litany of charges against him. what do you think are the most egregiously wrong charges? >> he's accused of things that happened after the revolution took place. there are a lot of things he's accused of that have been around for 150 years since the founding of the american colonies. there are some things like the bit about him taking people across the oceans for punishment, and when nobody was taken across any ocean at all. no american was taken across any ocean at all for punishment. so that's lot of padding. lawyer's padding. it's a propag...

King, only two of which he's guilty of. >> you're right. when you read the declaration, one is surprised the first time most of it is this litany of charges against him. what do you think are the most -- most egregiously wrong charges in the declaration of independence? >> there's a lot of expo facto revelations there, where he's accused of things that after the revolution took place. there are things he was accused from that had been around 150 years since the founding of the american colonies. there are some things like the bits about him taking people across the oceans for punishment when n...

On the transition. one of the e-mails that was released by congress earlier today which we wrote about shows that rob goldstone sent essentially a propaganda document to rhona gragt. gragt is president trump's longtime personal assistan. she was helping manage what got in front of him, what meetings he had during the transition. goldstone sent this propaganda document to gragt in november after election day. she saw it and thought it was important enough that she passed it along to bannon and asked him what they should do with it. bannon didn't reply to her e-mail in the documents that have be...

>> that's right. he's doing. >> which he does normally and which we've sort of gotten used to. >> if you take all of these things together, he knows from his joint defense agreement with his lawyers what questions are being asked people close to him. he knows that the investigation is starting to close in on him. >> what do you make of the dutch lawyer? i mean, a lot of people thought this was strange. strange for a number of reasons. it's extraordinary to indict a lawyer. he seems someone ancillary. the lies that were told were about this kind of propaganda document that skadden arps put toge...