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On something like the snap program. these are all parts of the record that cochran has wrapped up in the senate. it is something i think is reasonable to expect him to try to do again especially given the way the election just played out. >> part of the story the politics, a lot of republicans used to support it. to find the ones who will say that now is a different story. we'll take a look and see what happens. when we return when we finish with how political tribalism is threatening our system of government and what president obama is doing about it.

That money out. >> and they keep doing it. you say there have been some successes. you like the g.i. bill. you like the interstate highway system when we started building the big roads that connected us together. you liked welfare reform. but there are so many things going on right now where it is kind of like we're throwing good money after bad. >> yes. the expansion of money continues at pace. this is true in republican administrations as well as democrat administrations. the problems i identify in the book and the reasons i give for some concern really are not specific to democratic or repu...

Through this drug testing. >> this isn't about drug policy or consistency on libertarianism. it is about going after poor people and there's under current of race in this. they may never use a term related to race but they are sending a message to their base, oh, my goodness, look at these horrible, evil people sucking away our tax dollars and doing things like taking drugs when the fact of the matter is two-thirds of the people on the snap program are children, senior citizens and people with disabilities. there are veterans that need the program, active duty personnel and their families. thi...

Winter in my of the major cities and see men and women standing out in horrible weather catching buses to go to work. when you talk about the cutting the food stamps or the s.n.a.p. program, it is cutting benefits from the disabled, women and children, and most of the people who receive s.n.a.p. go to work everyday, but they earn minimum wage, and if you earn minimum wage, you are going to be making $15,000 a year, and in this country, $15,000 a year will put you in poverty. >> congressman cleaver, thank you so much for your time, and we are curious to see the results of this meeting after it ...

Budget which is always a danger because there's so many pieces that can be pointed to and try to win the bigger argument for savings and spending, but your opponent comes back and said, well you cut this, and that matters to people. your thoughts? >> look, chris, it ends up being a classic battle between the shock the conscious sound bite and the sudy of substance, often the sound bite will win, especially if you're scaring people. if you're on medicare, you're going to cut medicare, your grandson' pell grant, but the funny thing about information is people can go online and look this up for t...