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Thought that elena kagan would be the president's choice to fill the stevens seat. what led you to that conclusion? >> well, she politically looks a lot like barack obama. and presidents try to replicate themselves on the bench. most presidents do a very good job. there's a mythology out there that supreme court justices tend to surprise the president who appointed them. that's very rarely true. if you look at recent history, if you look at john roberts, samuel alito, appointed by president bush, steven breier and ruth ginsburg appointed by bill clinton, these justices reflect the politics of ...

Kagan. >> i don't really think we don't know at all. i think we have some sense of where she is. and i'd just like to disagree with michael a little bit. yes, it is true that the center of gravity in the court has moved to the right over the years. but it is not true that there are no liberals on the supreme court. steven breier, ruth ginsburg, john paul stevens who is leaving, i think have been liberal on many issues. so i don't think the court is as conservative an institution. but it is also true that barack obama's administration has been pretty conservative on national security issues, ha...