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Sight anyway, for quite a while, you know, this notion that the vice president, mike pence, could actually have a substantive role, even though it's not correct, kyou know, tht was sort of a strategy point that had been pushed for a long time and derived from the 1876 race between rutherford hayes and samuel tillman. where that same argument was made by the republicans in some ways successfully. because it prompted this this compromise that actually resulted in the republican getting elected. so that this was pushed -- that's not a surprise. but rick perry, you know, he's an establishment guy,...

People who are elected to school boards are typically white, wealthier, almost carpet baggers who insert themselves in this. then they get to the state legislature and obliterate voting rights. your viewers already know how ridiculous the argument is to make. but the bigger strategy point is how do you stop this from happening at the school board level because there has to be policy to prevent this kind of thing and that is the key. if they can take away our history and rewrite the narrative, then they take away the ability to speak a truthful story about this country. i sometimes wonder is it...

Goldman starts his questioning this morning, what do you think this democratic attorney will try to get at from these witnesses? >> strategy point number one for the democrats. quid pro quo, what the republicans are now calling conditionality. best termed i think as a corrupt deal. they need to drive this home. these witnesses are strong on that. bill taylor testified previously. that was my clear understanding. security assistance money would not come until the president of ukraine committed to pursue the investigation. of course bill taylor said the same thing at the time this was happening....

Help them out. in this she did the complete opposites. >> brendan, i wonder from a strategy point of views, her cartoonish phone call i think brought more attention to the story, whereas had she left it alone, respectfully, i don't think a lot of us would have seen it. >> of course. she clearly overreacted. i'm actually glad that "the examiner" released the audio, for the reason it teaches professionals in a lesson that this is not okay, and there are consequences for acting like this. the reason i'm glad they did it, i am concerned as a republican there's a whole gen raft of reps that are lea...

Maybe jonathan's right and there's some other piece of evidence they're trying to protect. if there was a strategy point that came out of that and i'm not con advised there w-- convi there was one at 9:00 at night on television. >> to point out there are other people on television at the same time as rudy giuliani. they were completely coherent. so i don't know why -- like we're half joking but we're half serious. >> maybe he had a heavy meal and was kind of -- >> no, we're talking whether or not he was -- >> it slows him downs are slurs yours words. >> no. >> i know if i have, mika, a big mea...