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Saying, said that it has provoked a debate that has been useful in this country. and what snowden said to me was, i've brought the american public to the table. and he also said, if in fact he's smeared and his reputation is ruined, he said, if i end up in a ditch at the end of the day and reform comes out of this, it will be worth of it. >> what mike rogers says, he says if you take a look at the stuff snowden stole, some of it does deal with the privacy rights of the american public. but most of it, he says, deals with major military-related issues that only a country like russia or china ...

Condone the way he went about this. there were options for him, whether it was reporting to congress, reporting to an inspector general, to respect the fact that he filed an agreement that he would not disclose classified information and he violated that, and that's the essence of the government's case against him. >> the president we just heard in dan lothian's piece said checks are in place. and then all of a sudden, we learn about this in the "washington post" today. are more shoes likely to drop? because we have no idea what other stuff snowden may have taken from the u.s. government and g...

Come to grips with this weird belief in creating heroes out of losers. this stuff snowden is giving away. the director says it is possible he may have given out secrets that actually help china. >> obviously. >> this stuff can start an armed conflict. this guy is not a hero. >> he is dangerous. >> why do you want the president telling the bad guys our strategies. >> what are you talking about? >> you said the president should tell people why we do it and how we do it. >> no i didn't say give a how-to m manual. i said he should speak. speak to the american people. don't hide in the white house....

A bigger scandal and we have to come to grips with this weird belief in creating heroes out of losers. this stuff snowden is giving away. the director says it is possible he may have given out secrets that actually help china. >> obviously. >> this stuff can start an armed conflict. this guy is not a hero. >> he is dangerous. >> why do you want the president telling the bad guys our strategies. >> what are you talking about? >> you said the president should tell people why we do it and how we do it. >> no i didn't say give a how-to m manual. i said he should speak. speak to the american people...