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Where he rebels against the norms being put in place around him. john kelly his new chief of staff has put in some symbol lance of order in the white house. he's gotten the president some symbol answer of -- but the president took a very very baby and nonpartisan step by non-partnership and he is rebelling against that because he's getting concerned. even if he hadn't done the nfl thing, during that rally he was very equivocal, he made sure he was not going to win, basically said a bunch of nice thing, undid it quickly so the headlines in alabama were trump hedges on strains. you can see the p...

Complicated to sourt out. there's a lot of symbol lance. how much it's going to affect things on the ground is open to a lot of debate and question. the polling places, precinct locations, voting rules, that may be more difficult to catch. but a lot of law developed. there's a lot of law in the area outside of section five. but in terms of symbolic proportions, this is hugely moe mentous in the his riff of the united states supreme court. >> judith joins me as well from washington, d.c. do you agree with that? what is your reaction to the court's ruling? >> well, i think we have to understand ...