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Police state. i would we need have to all these records checked, whether it's healthkm? care, automobil, our dna, whether it's all these other things. i mean, come out of the shadows, mr. president, be honest with the american people and tell us about your fundamental transformation. that's what i want him to do. >> neil: what i'm worried about, if you look at the various mark, the common theme is, snooping on people, whether it's conservative groups and being targeted by ther isers and then individual -- the irs and thenç individuals, and the justice department going after a few ap journal...

Getting information from the irs was when i was a federal prosecutor. so those federal prosecutors can access the information through the grand jury, when no one else can. so the reality is, prosecutors are best suited to access that information. i'm not sure some of this information congress could not get. the question is, what will congress do with it? we canned fire anybody. we can control funding, management oversight, all of which we can do while there's a criminal investigation going on. >> neil: i didn't know who the irs was afraid of but there's a group even more fearful than ther iser...

Just winning. even if you don't win. >> we have to push against in ther isers and the federal government in general. i'm very excited that congress has come to the party now. but the reality is the irs was created by congress, fumedded by congress and oversight by congress and they brought us to where we are today. >> neil: do you expect someone was pulling the strings before the irs? >> absolutely. we tracked it to the top lawyer at the treasury department that new this was going on. when people take the fifth they do about -- >> neil: he didn't but lois lerner who headed the digs is. what do...

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