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>> is that what you're hearing? >> i think that's right. if you look at the republican caucus in the house and similar in the senate. a quarter are the real true believers, the ted cruz characters, or at least posing as true believers. then you have the other three-quarters who really would like to workout deals, keep the government functioning, but are scared to death of a primary challenge from these tea party republicans. and i think finally they're saying, you know what? we'll take that risk because the alternative that the guys have shown us is unacceptable. >> if you look at the numbers,...

Officials have settled this, they are not possibly going to do this again, it seems like there's another government crisis. how do we stop this psych? >> well, we need long-term solutions and we need a budgetment for six months the democrats have been trying to set up a conference committee on the budget. the republicans, particularly in the house, want one thing, the democrats and the president want something else. compromise in the middle, that's what we need to do. >> maryland democratic senator, ben cardin, thank you so much. more on the shutdown and the debt deadline with california senat...

Default has been a lot of false demagoguery. >> there's no thing as a debt cerealing in this country. i would dispel the rumor going around that you hear on every newscast, if we don't raise the debt ceiling, we will default on our debt. we won't. >> first of all, do you agree to that? and secondly, let's say it technically does not immediately cause default. aren't the markets driven by psychology? >> well, i think it's the second point that's the critical point. i think what the folks are talking about and don't happen to endorse it, and this was not john boehner's strategy, is that the cons...

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