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Cities -- per 10,000 and non-sanctuary, there are 432 per 10,000. but the study also said that sanctuary areas have a lower unemployment, higher household income by $4,000 a year. people under the poverty line. so is it the chicken or the egg? is it because it is a sanctuary city or is it because -- >> bill: i don't believe the study at all. i think it is bogus. my opinion. but we have an obligation to present it. a second study done by whom? >> by the university of california, right here, by riverside. they say there really isn't any different. >> bill: no difference. >> although they think v...

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