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This to sus itself out and get a bigger and larger picture of it. we still don't know the full extent of it, though. there's still a lot here, even from the things that we learned tonight about why was it that manafort who was running the campaign, was taking this polling data to these folks to share it with them? what would actually motivate that? what was truly behind that. and that is the frustrating thing about this story or the intriguing thing, is that we get these little clues, but we don't get the full picture. the central question is unanswered, why is it that they're lying. >> jeremy...

As i read that, it's -- the government, we may not have other people we would be bringing to trial or because of manafort's shady history with lying, we may not be able to put him on the stand, this is something that has valuable information about russia, about the ukraine, and i think they saw him as a potential source of real intel. >> based on your reading, your experience as a fid. do you think it's really possible that manafort had reason or has reason to fear for his safety or the members of his family? >> he may. at this point, manafort is in jail right now, so the prisons do a pretty g...

Hearing. it was an evidentiary presentation. the judge actually invited the attorneys to sit down, the hearing was so long. so this in effect was a second trial for manafort on these factual charges. >> barrett, you mentioned to one of our producers today, let's not lose track of the fact that to manafort, this will make the difference between a death sentence in jail, potentially and not. the judge has to decide, was this guy truly trying to cooperate and just having memory issues? or is it as the feds paint it, that he was a serial liar? >> for manafort, the stakes really couldn't be any hig...

Traditional cooperating witness, they were intrigued by the intelligence value manafort could offer. as i read that, it's -- the government, we may not have other people we would be bringing to trial or because of manafort's shady history with lying, we may not be able to put him on the stand, this is something that has valuable information about russia, about the ukraine, and i think they saw him as a potential source of real intel. >> based on your reading, your experience as a fid. do you think it's really possible that manafort had reason or has reason to fear for his safety or the members...

Inauguration. we've also learned from these new documents that even after trump had won the white house, manafort went back to working for politicians in the ukraine in 2017. as a consultant for a potential candidate. that work continued even after he was indicted in that same year. within these transcripts, there's also a reference to sanctions against russia, as the issue of sanctions appears to impart some of the meetings between trump campaign associates and the russians, there continue to be questions about the president's willingness to enforce sanctions while in office. it's a lot to ge...