Transcripts For ALJAZ Studio B Unscripted 20240711

Rely on holiday trade. Christmas temple mean thats how people get the now no mortgage no get beautyful holiday and now they should now again the food and Drug Administration is set to review a new vaccine this week its a process that in the past would have taken months but in what amounts to a life or death situation hell the chills are hoping it will take a matter of hours based on the data that i know i expect the f. D. A. To make a positive decision but of course its their decision and as you probably know they are totally separated and fired from the operation they will make their own judgement based on the data and i hope that the decision will be positive but even when they are approved it will take months before the vaccines are widely available to the general public be thinking in the february march timeframe that youre going to see more general vaccination and by the 2nd quarter of next year will still have enough vaccine for every american that wants it as Health Officials continue to call on americans to follow social distancing measures and no other member of trumps inner circle who hasnt followed that advice has fallen ill to the virus Rudy Giuliani personal attorney was reportedly hospitalized sunday after he tested positive he traveled the country last week trying to help the president overturn the election it was trump who announced his lawyer has coded 19 on twitter calling it the china virus meanwhile the pandemic is claiming the lives of 2 americans every minute. Castro aljazeera washington south koreas military will be deployed as the president calls for expanded krone Virus Testing and tracing more than 600. 00 cases were reported on monday the 30th day in the row of the daily triple digit increases of experts are warning if this trend continues the Hospital System could be overwhelmed Robert Bryant has more from seoul. It is a concerning situation here in south korea this is the 3rd time in a month that weve had an increase in these restrictions and that is because weve been seeing over the same period of time an increase in the number of daily cases being reported now well over 600. 00 new cases per day south korea has a 5 tier system in place and these latest restrictions that will come into force will put it at 2. 5 it will mean things like further restrictions on restaurants are gatherings indoors also on transport for example on intercity trains and buses theyll be a 50 percent cap on the number of passengers meanwhile there will be no small spectators in sports venues once more and also private companies will be urged to have around a 3rd of their workers working remotely from home we also know that j. And the president of south korea has called on the military to provide more testing now south korea has been a pioneer of test and trace well it seems as though the system here may not be good enough to deal with this so there are being more resources there. But as well an Opposition Leader why dont slam sundays parliamentary vote as a fraud the 1st official results are being announced for the poll which was boycotted by the opposition its likely that the president Nicolas Maduro will consolidate his hold on power of service a voter turnout was historically low because between the u. K. And the European Union are said to be on a knife edge as they struggle to secure a post brick sit trade deal they remain divided over 3 key issues after 8 months of talks they have until the end of the year to reach an agreement those were the headlines question follow all stories on our website at aljazeera dot com more news in half an hour to stay with us. When you play for england i was never really going to be as accepted is my strive for talent spot you name is and why race is not an opinion when racism is an ideology thats fundamentally olds without Democratic Values you know if youre not upsetting people youre not seeing and you know. You had our o. L. My name is any honor and you care. Im the sporting director of Aston Villa Women Football Club i used to be a striker one time well the shop job. And im also a media commentator and a lawyer. I have worked in human rights and development ive worked as a barrister a journalist an academic and a writer if always harder to diagnose rates of them in polite circles in britain because we covered it my name is a for her. I grew up in london but my mothers family is originally from ghana i was born in nigeria but came to the u. K. As a baby and grew up in birmingham ive read any memoir about her passion for football since she was a young girl. She was at the top of her career as a successful striker when she was dropped from the England National team after speaking out against racism. Into a man play we dont 102 comes from a country after 11 years of playing i didnt get it takes a lot of courage and determination to do that i know that africa has struggled with her through an identity because shes of mixed heritage i spent my whole life wondering if this was really my country. Shes even moved to africa twice to connect with culture shes also written amazing book about it so im curious to compare our personal experiences and our sense of belonging to. Africa is a part of both and me but we also british and black women so we have more than a few things in common but were actually quite different. Any other there were so many things in your book which are very personally related oh im so happy i loved it i love the i thought it was so on earth and sort of revealing because i followed your career in real time and i thought i knew the story of what happened but actually i discovered there was so much that i didnt know but the 1st thing i wanted to ask you about was the way you talk about identity and you use the phrase hyphenated identities to talk about your british nigerian background how you reconcile that relationship now because its obviously 2 very different lives that youve lived one in nigeria and one in birmingham where you grew up obviously writing the book is quite a reflective process so i really started to think about what how did i feel about myself when i was younger i was a popular kid you know i played football the boys loved me because i was running rings around them but actually it was a girl i was trying to be a boy the whole time there is the photo of you in your book with him that you have he was quite young like so happy to be i really think i want to the boy was like that was just biggest tomboy but i actually really break that down i asked the boys to call me eddie i didnt want them to call me any which is my nigerian name and actually allow. My nigerian name i love my name in your honor but all of that i shut out for a long time and didnt actually want to explore and then theres all that stuff about actually when you play for england youre supposed to be as english as they come you know youre wearing the badge literally bar my names any other luko so i was never really going to be as accepted as my strike a counterpart whose name was and why. And now im very much somebody that loves being a nigerian woman so the concept of hyphenated identity in my head was all about this constant balancing act that we have to do i love rich tea biscuits and lots of british stuff but i also love to law for us. So we shouldnt read it we should embrace it or ive heard black british people doing such Creative Things with hyphens with but we often call ourselves black british british nigerian british command ive even heard someone refer to themselves as a free saxon which i thought rather like their creative but theres always this question should we need to hyphenate you know weve spent all our lives in britain you were playing for england and i think if you ask a lot of english people what is the ultimate representation or symbol of englishness many of them would point to the Football Team i mean certainly for me growing up that was an image of englishness and for me at the time when the england team was very white and england fans were very white and it was one of those things that made me feel excluded from the idea that i could be english and i think its no coincidence we often call ourselves british or black british if they were very rare to hear a person color say in describing themselves as english did you feel that this team has often represented quite a white idea of englishness was no longer going to be so much and because you are it and other but they are in it when youre playing football you know thats the beauty of football its kind of if youre talented youre in. And you dont think about you dont have to think about identity until you get a bit older and you realise if youre playing badly thats when media starts saying on nigerian born and they start becoming the other so when you do well youre britain where when you die your. Love and youre not doing so well youre kind of and thats the kind of dark side of sport and its not just exclusive to me its meant to in a measure ozo fast most famously stuck speaking about it you know. And he said when im winning work up some german when we lose and we do very badly im turkish reading your book i felt as if you really went on a journey where you started questioning things along the way but you were always very reserved in judgment and gave give people the benefit of the doubt the other way you describe things i think that speaks to my desperation in a way to just be accepted as thing as footballers you just want to play football and that becomes a culture of just play football you know and so i used to dumb down my intelligence a lot and the questions that pop up obliged to ask but put the ball in the back of the net you know and it dates back to you know what i was saying earlier about just wanting to be one of the boys are you speak about it in your book you know at one point you wanted people to call you caroline but it like my middle name is caroline and i remember very clearly when i was 6 when i change schools in my 6 year old mind i said to my friends this is a chance for a new start i am no longer going to start again were going to keep it simple im carol i am you know i was literally trying to rebrand myself but why was that. I think that partly its an inherent issue if you dont look like either of your parents so my mother came to the u. K. From ghana when she was 12 and shes a black woman from majority Black Country and i dont think she had a particularly racialized identity as youll know if youre african from an african country race is not your primary identify its your region or your religion or your ethnic group real language everyones blacks not a thing and my father is why its but i think as a small child you notice that you dont look like either of your parents and thats not necessarily a bad thing but it is just the thing and then in my case it was compounded by the fact that there werent any other people around the who looked like me and i remember told a story that parents when my sister was born shes 5 years younger than me the 1st thing i said when i saw who is that she looked like me. And that was the 1st on my parents realize that i wasnt expecting to ever see someone who was i thought that no one else did look like me because that was the environment i grew up in my father also has this immigration story his father was a jewish child refugee from germany but within a generation he dissimulated into britishness you know he married an english lady my grandmother i dont think anyone ever asked my father or their siblings his siblings growing up about you know his immigration status or what the impact of their immigration had been in britain or where he was really from but my mother because of my mothers heritage that people ask those very questions about me its that visible blackness that makes you really british you must have another story right and my logic was well if its because of my mother that people treat me differently then if i go to my mothers country then ill ill solve all my problems are just going to garner and be going to and i live happily ever after and so its a little bit of a shock to the system well the 1st thing that happened when i went and i thought i was going suddenly thin is that gun in school me which means white person in nigeria or you will i think all that you know that interior. And i was horrified i was saying they dont understand in britain they said im black. Now im hurt and i dont know me why thats not theres nothing you can do about that and ive spent lots more timing and i understand you know to a good man i represent. A european not bringing not even so much about my mixed race heritage its more about my social conditioning and i have to acknowledge that and also theres a level of color privilege that comes out of a history of colonialism that there is privilege that people of european heritage get in african countries so not to acknowledge that would be to benefit from that privilege not understanding what it means and the damage it still does but the other thing is that because in school i used to you know i went to predominantly white school and the girls that picked on me were actually black tobin and they used to say you know african butu in the state make up my big lips and pull my hair in and one of them is mixed race for pretty girl i used to think you know sometimes used to think life would be so much easier if i was mixed i dont want to be that and i dont want to be that i just want to be in the middle you know and so there is that there is that sense of you know colorism and and you know we have it in other races too as big emphasis on the color you know the actual color and the shades and where that ranks and i think there is still often a tendency to if theres an Advertising Campaign use a mixed race model someone of jewel heritage with lighter skin and curly hair and it is almost the acceptable face the blackness but the 1st one i had to go on are just going back to that story the other thing that happened to me was that i said to my mother. I was black and i remember exactly what i meant because the immigration officials obviously were black theres a framed photo of the president on the wall he was black the police were black the Army Officers were black the pilots were black and my mother also said that was the 1st time shed realized that i did not live in a world. Where black people wore suits were in power were at the top on the bottom and i hadnt i didnt know i was missing that until i saw it you dont even realize how much you internalize the idea of what power looks like its still on usual to see somebody who is black in a position of real power i mean look weve never had a black Prime Minister weve never had a black judge in the Supreme Court theres only one black person in the c. 100 as a c. E. O. There has been so little progress compared to what i think many people expected but. At you know this is theres all these bus words about Diversity Inclusion but do you feel like diversity and inclusion have just become that deliberate attempts to try and please rather than actually it changing what we see in terms of power i do worry about that when you have one or 2 black people or people of color in the room but that hasnt been the cultural change that allows their voices to really be heard or theyre in such minority or not a position of enough power to really challenge the status quo then it doesnt change the outcome doesnt change the culture doesnt change the Decision Making and then to add insult to injury that person to be wheeled out if something goes wrong having one person in the room who may be put appreciates that nuance is not enough you need to have what would you know then is is the way to change it i think we need to be more radical in our approach and often ive seen this generation who are absolutely no nonsense i have to say and a lot more on a polygenic in their approach just. Taking a different route starting up their own organizations and their own movements and really creating that Critical Mass of this generation they hold internet press conferences not just you know it is a cousin of the language of social media and Global Networks to organize to mobilize and really create campaigns that make change and i for 1 am so impressed by that and energized by yeah i mean its fine thank you renee lets find out what you guys yes any questions so my question relates to the scandal into the caribbean people that have been deported and denied citizenship despite having lived in britain or their lives but also to the conservative cabinet and in particular to the ethnic minority members whove done absolutely nothing to help so i just want to know is there a case for arguing that racism. And systemic disadvantage cant be dismantled without 1st addressing issues of class i agree i think classes is a separate conversation from race ive been in situations where ive been the 1st to do 2 to do it and that is pressure in itself but then you get the expectation of all well what about us is like well give me a chance to you know figure out how going to change this 1st so its not easy but the agenda should always be to think about how you can open the door for others that look like you i dont think the wind rushing could have happened to people who were not both black and working class you know there are middle class people who could have been affected but they had the ability to hire lawyers or get professional advice to prevent them from being deported and this was really systematically targeted people who were excluded from those systems of power because of race and class but i think that the last concern. The government was particularly hostile as weve seen read to me there is nothing more profound than rounding up and deporting british people if you have told me that would have happened 10 years ago i dont know the code of believe that its just type in but i also think that black people we need to vote we need to vote if we all voted it would be a lot harder for politicians to get away with this kind of behavior because we dont hold them to account where an expendable community to them we also have to take responsibility as well i have a wide range of friends and you know when you asked them a why did you vote a certain way or because storms he said of bias. Well thats not thats not enough for you to like educate yourself understand how this is the effect if i vote this way you know because theres also pressure to vote how your parents or grandparents voted no so i also think that theres a lot of conditioning in ethnic minority communities where its like we have to think this way we all of the this way no were much more powerful than that both of you guys within your own regard are considered to be role models to a lot of different people so how are you using both of your platforms to legitimize. You know the things that are sort of under represented by society in you know whether it be sport or whether it be race i take that responsibility so seriously i feel really strongly that its important to show a Younger Generation not just that you can get in the room but that you can get in the room and be authentic because i dont think theres any point in us getting in the room if were not going to be authentic when not going to be pushing for change and i often put myself in quite uncomfortable spaces where im saying things that the people around me dont want to hear and the reason im doing that is for my own the self or is for younger people looking at me because i know that we dont get change by doing the same things we have to be honest and we have to be honest even when everything is conspired to silence us but i also think we need to be strategic and we have to think what is power who actually is in power what are the avenues of control and authority influence and how can we start to shape our own destiny but it is a big responsibility and if you feel so visible as well because there are fewer of us in the higher you go there are fewer of us and people to look at you and i remember the people i looked up to when i was young the huge influence they had on me and there were so few people to look up to which meant they meant all the more to me you know one of them. Is is what you just said the comfortable spaces that you. Put yourself in throughout my career ive had the opportunity to be the 1st a lot and i could have been like no like i just had to stay in my lane you know footballs and kick goals like i like i do stay in my comfort zone but nothing really changes need to inspire people if you do that you might do but not really. So ive been really inspired by the opportunity to be the 1st. Because i think its only then that you can really open the door. And i take it very seriously you know when i am the 1st i have to be the most 3rd person here and as a woman the reality is you probably have to work doubly as hard as if you make a mistake the margin for error is very very particular in football where its can youre competing with men where its like why did i get that you know that that opportunity any say that you know i go into unconsciousness spaces but one of the things i took most from your book you know it really touched me was the story where any playing football and shes the only girl and shes winning as you always seem to do just scoring go off to go off to go all. The dads the supporters of dads you have the boys on your own team for whom you are winning started being hostile and saying why she here get her off because they felt so threatened that you were beating their sons how hard must it be to continue to excel in the face of that kind of hostility instead of rewarding you for your talent actually punishing you about it very hard it was really hard because. As a kid i each want to be kept up for doing well like you know for scoring goals and. But then i started to realize that human beings are very jealous or they want you to shine but not too much dont shine as much as my son. And to be honest i went back home and i was. I dont play football anymore its too stressful so for like a year i was like i want to play tennis and i play tennis and i started when the b. s like the williams sisters them because you know because they were like black women and it was like ok its easier to be them rather than be different all the time so it was hard because i didnt understand it i didnt get it what did i do wrong. Im a good footballer and i. But you know thats i think now i look back on that. Success comes with opposition you know if youre not upsetting people youre not saying anything you know. Oh i like the other day i went on a i went on the show as a football show called the debate and i made a mistake and there was so many people on social media law our market she doesnt know what shes talking about she just said mine united rather man city and no matter how well you do there will always be people that are like she doesnt have to be there she made a mistake just waiting to pounce. But they wont be talking about you if you werent there 1st the way i kind of try and look at it. Stronger. Now a lot of International Charities have come under a lot of criticism for harvey we present africans in their fund raising complains what is your view about what they can do to me to gape this and what is the role of black people globally to own their own narrative thats a really great question. Because actually one of the things ive tried to do through social media my own social media when i travel to africa is to show sides of africa that are just not represented in mainstream the beautiful sides. I was we said in ghana in a cry and i was a slag this is such an amazing place and i was shown the Art Galleries the news exceed in the colonies see. But of course there are you know there are sort of extreme poverty as well you know its about i think showing a whole list moralistic side of both of africa and again africa can be broken down into so many different compartments as well i work with a charitable Charity Water and they actually deliberately dont show you know the images of poor african kids with flies around their faces this is they show Economic Empowerment in african villages they show strong women pairing in the water but i think one of global scale actually africa to the world is becoming a bit more of a positive conversation i think theres poverty everywhere and i dont think we should ever try and sanitize it you know there is poverty anyway its not our job to try and remember size it or hide it we should be very honest about the problems of poverty we face my issue with the narrative around British Charity it is of a few different elements on the one hand i think theres a context that is almost never present so for example britain draws outs in untaxed profits more multiple times as much every year as it gets through International Aid and charity and so we talk about this continent. Continent is a place of need and suffering and we dont talk about the extent to which it still makes british people rich every day and i feel that if you really care about suffering on the african continent then why are we not redistributing the wealth from these huge profits that keep the top one percent rich and that is something that i feel responsible charity should be addressing poverty while also putting it in its proper context i mean that context has a history the history is empire where we betrayed africans as savage you know as as dehumanised and so when i see charities depicting african children without the same dignity as they depict british children i immediately see the weight of that history of children everywhere deserve their dignity to be protected so im not saying people shouldnt support African Charities i think we should support African Charities we should do it on the standing that the agents of change in africa always been africans africans have been building africa they continue to build africa in the face of adversity in the face of continued economic exploitation by countries like britain so its just about putting some honesty back into that narrative thank you for those questions. If you raise fact facts about the empire people become hysterical they say you hate britain if you like dont like it here leave one of my frustrations right now with football is that i feel that were talking too much about race and nothings actually happening. Weve never had a president who has literally for 4 or 5 years repeatedly attacked our democracy. You know loosely related to everything actually i have a narrative i have a question youre hitting every where people can get treated and just false or even further join me Richelle Carey and up front is my guest from around the world take the hot seat in the debate the weeks top stories in pressing issues here on our just here. If you want to help save the world. Into your own. We want you all just there with me to hell robin in doha reminder of our top news stories millions of people across the u. S. State of california are preparing for harsh new lockdown rules to come into place in the next few hours the state has reported its highest number of new kovac 19 infections more than 30000 in a day south koreas military will be deployed as the president calls for expanded credit are as testing and tracing more than 600 cases were reported on monday the 30th day in a row of daily triple digit increases. A warning if this trend continues the Hospital System could be overwhelmed. Rob right has more from seoul. It is a concerning situation here in south korea this is the 3rd time in a month that we have had an increase in these restrictions and it is because weve been seeing over the same period of time an increase in the number of daily cases being reported now well over 600. 00 new cases per day south korea has a 5 tier system in place and these latest restrictions that will come into force will put it at 2. 00 it will mean things like further restrictions on restaurants are gatherings indoors also on transport venezuelan Opposition Leader slams sundays parliamentary vote as a fraud the 1st official results are just being announced for the poll which was boycotted by the opposition its likely president Nicolas Maduro will consolidate his hold on power observers say voter turnout was historically low because the United Kingdom and the European Union are said to be on a knife edge as they struggle to secure a post brics it trade deal they remain divided over 3 key issues after 8 months of talks they have until the end of the year to reach an agreement record numbers of migrants and refugees arriving on the shores of Spains Canary islands many making the dangerous journey by sea hurt and losing their income during the pandemic temporary camps are being set up by the government to cope with the influx of more than 300. 00 people have been arrested in the belorussian capital in yet another weekend of protests against the president demonstrators are demanding an end to Alexander Lukashenko is 26 year rule theyve been protests since the disputed election in august in which look at shanker won a 6th term those were the headlines more news of folly in half an hour to stay with us here on. So after i know weve got a little in common in terms of our legal background. I really wanted to ask you about going into the barrister world when i look at who i am and who i was when i was younger i was always that person that was good at speaking was kind of disturbed by injustice to kill a mockingbird was a book that i reading gauged with and the whole idea of like speaking up for the voiceless and so i think i always had a lawyer in me this final for how long you pursued both you continue to play sport at the highest level when you pull a fight and practiced as a lawyer as well yeah well i thought once i graduated i was like or im on the path now my eyes will finish. And as you do all the playing things. I think like you i was influenced by books that show i also loved to go out there and i i had a strong sense of injustice and i was not afraid of an argument. From quite a young age i have to admit my curiosity for people i mean everything ive done has been driven by the fact that im interested in people and curious about them and i do to try to help people wherever i can and did you feel once you got into that world embarrass the world you know you talk about in your book did you feel like oh my gosh this is so non diverse like wheres the other women was there that i mean its i mean and then theres black you know at that stage in my life i was getting frustrated because id grown up in wimbledon thinking as soon as i leave school im going to choose a very different environment right and then i went through oxford and i thought through as i did also im going to be in a very different environment and then i went to the bar is like this isnt happening for me. The bar is very unreconstructed reacting missions that you shouldnt write i mean we were white horse hair wigs in court right now im not really quick badge or anything yeah you know i actually well i get that i like as for wigs you know why because. When i wasnt wearing it my clients mistook me for a codefendant i mean people thought and so did all the lawyers or they thought i was worse because at least from a defendant im doing something worse they thought i was the girlfriend of the defendant she said like at least 5 going to be a criminal act of one. That was frustrated when i put on the wig everybody knew who i was if youre young and black and female that can be helpful you need props one of my frustrations right now with football is that i feel like were talking too much about race and nothing is actually happening and i know youve said that you dont feel like we talk enough about race so i feel like we have a different viewpoint on that because 10 years ago race in football was a sort of elephant in the room no one to talk about it no one said the r. Word now i almost feel like im called up every week to talk tonight to rent a quote a quote from a new lead and im actually like why arent you calling you a for but why arent you calling for an Association Decision makers about like why this is not being punished more so i just feel like we have this conversation thats a click bait that makes people click on and click on twitter and kind of brings this level of divisiveness versus actual action i think my analysis is that were talking about race but were not having a high quality conversation and i think the conversation that were having is incredibly basic i mean im in a slightly different position because im not talking about race in the sporting world. I think the world im in still denies that racism exists so i mean weve seen recently this whole spectacle of her and megan leaving britain and absolutely real experience of high profile broadcasters. Claiming that racism doesnt exist while actively being racist its a very bizarre ive had phone calls from wreckage on the saying i dont understand this is like the conversation were having in the 1960 s. Im im missing something and i just say no you dont missing anything this is the conversation in britain i think that people dont know what racism ists so race is people think that racism is having personal vitriol towards black people or people of color in that if you feel you can personally absolve yourself from having what they imagine a racist thoughts or doing racist things then theres nothing to see here and theres no understanding of what systemic racism is of Structural Racism of how race can operate and i think you do a really good job of explaining this new book how race can operate in subtle ways a lot of times and sometimes it can be patterns of behavior sometimes it can be treating people differently rather than saying anything thats openly coded as racist and i think that because we dont understand a history of empire as well or White Supremacy we dont understand the legacies of that you know these whole ideas about angry black women or about. Black people being associated with crime you know the way that we criminalize crime if there is a paedophile who is of Asian Heritage its an asian grooming gangs and will not vast majority of paedophilic crimes in britain are carried out by white people we dont call it white paedophiles or white crime it creates myself like a small thing but i think a lot of people now believe that only asian people can be paedophiles you know and given that this is already a minority about him so much bigger insists that is a highly toxic and dangerous tripe and i pressed promote it i mean this isnt the right wing fringe this is the Mainstream Press on the front page day off today so you know my grandfather was a jewish refugee from nazi germany and he is no longer alive but his brother is he was kinda transport and im so fascinated by that period in his. How people can go from having so many jewish people who are considered german or who consider themselves german to going to the other extreme and i think people forget that didnt happen overnight how it started was with topflight headlines and with truth and with narratives that conflated the identities and the history of jewish people with certain negative hate filled stereotypes and thats why i think im so sensitive to those narratives that people might say you know its an overreaction to conflate this to nazi germany and the reason to compare is to understand how it starts and to prevent it of of the coming back stream we havent approached that extreme nowhere near it yet but we have seen an increase in hate crime we have seen unprecedented levels of anxiety unfair among many of our ethnic minority communities people saying they dont feel safe in space as they used to feel say do you want to do you have conversations with your fellow journalists about the responsibility that we have to make sure that in not perpetuating some of the stuff because i feel like whenever i speak to. Other journalists they try and pretend as if i dont write the headlines but its like when im writing a column every single word it matters so i dont i just i just feel like the media i used to think of journalists like you know like lawyers and i think the media these things have just become so desperate and so kind of base in the profession that were now perpetuating a lot of you know the problem there are also i think kind of structural factors so for example i think theres a lot of false equivalence and what i mean by that is this idea that if you have somebody like me who talks back and see racism about how to combat and fight racism theres this idea that you need to balance me out with a racist race thats not an opinion right racism is an ideology thats fundamentally at odds with our Democratic Values but i fear its becoming normalised by. Ignorance at best and at worst a kind of malicious attempts to really dbase the narrative to get more views more clicks and i really think its crucial to call this out and i dont think this can be left to journalists i think we all need to call this out i actually think this is a loser and i have got to go to question time anywhere. On your point about journalism and how the media is in a way complicit in continue racist narrative so i would like to get into the Meat Industry would advise could you both give to me to try to in some way combat those narrative swaps im in the room because it can be quite challenging or im a bit ignorant to the actual process of like what happens in a news room we have recent examples where like you know kobe bryant sadie passes away and his is mistaken for Le Bron James that to me thats bonkers and that thats happened of quite a few times i think having a more diverse newsroom will help that but then i dont know whether actually practically speaking you would have a say in changing. What you know is a racist headline i think there is no substitute for diversity so on that basis i think its so important that young journalists from all backgrounds go into journalism thats what they want to do but you need to be prepared for the fact that its not a Straight Path and what i did which worked really well for me was actually to do Something Else 1st to build up my knowledge my expertise my credibility so that when i went in a i had the confidence to speak and challenge and be i had to be listened to because i was someone who had the credentials that may be difficult to ignore in a way im kind of losing interest in asking me to organizations to take us seriously to pay us equally to listen because a serious we have to keep all seem to thats like weve already lost why are we asking to be paid the same as our white similarly educated similarly qualified counterparts and i think that sometimes we have to vote with our feet and there are lots of very inspiring examples of people whove started their own media organizations and who understand how to reach audiences like them and are actually changing the way the whole media works by their example so i think we need we need to be represented in big Mainstream Media organizations thats theres no substitute for that but its not the only way a lot of times frustration with the system pushes you to do. An amazing thing that you would never have done if you were in the sort of majorities so sometimes its about saying well ok i can get in that way im going to get in this way and do it myself and my last piece of ice is find allies you know there are allies everywhere you just have to find them and dont assume that black people or your allies also dont assume all white people are not your allies their allies and youve got to find them work with them and create those networks and i found that incredibly powerful in my career ive had white men whove been huge allies ive had black women whove supported me ive had people from all different backgrounds who ive worked 1 with so i think find your allies know who they are work with them for a change both of you have roots in former british colonies can you talk about your experience of learning about colonialism and compared with what you learned to school and the impact you think the lack of colonial education in this country has on people on how brits see race and their own identity as well my colonial education was nonexistent im actually still learning now. Its nonexistent enough as book actually how. I look back at my secondary School Education and i learned more about Martin Luther king was a parks america africanamerican Civil War History than i did about colonialism why because we dont want to touch on the things that we did in britain its easier to talk about that you know so that disappoints me. I guess its never too late to learn and i think now with rex and the kind of those feelings and sentiments theres a lot more focus on britain. Now but also like where is it all coming from where is this sort of nationalist sentiment coming from so i think now people are delving more into those questions. And i think theres a push back a little bit from africa you know if you speak to people in business in africa its like its almost like we dont want the kind of 100 outselling we want to do ourselves and i think that comes from a postcolonialism mentality that shift in so yeah i didnt have. Yes i didnt have a. Little education in history which i loved with love history went from henry the 8th to the 2nd world war im not exaggerating and when you actually analyze what was left or how it says a lot just happens to be the entire period of empire building and unfortunately i have a daughter whos a turning 9 and very little has changed theyre actually being educated to believe something thats not true which is that britain existed in isolation and i think thats incredibly dangerous you know i think that ignorance about the British Empire which is by far the most important period in british history in the last 1000 years you cannot understand our position in the world the reason were a Multicultural Society our relationship with europe you cannot understand our industry you cant understand our regions none of it there is not a family in britain i believe that has not been touched by empire either because someone in that family worked for the empire empire was a huge source of employment and sociability for working class white boys historically so many people who couldnt find opportunity in england scotland and wales went to the empire where they were able to move off in society its a complicated history and i think its also important to say that there was not really one empire there were multiple empires you know britain in west africa was very different from the raj in india to the caribbean to hong kong or Southeast Asia and i think we know almost nothing about this its completely invisible and not only has it been a raise from the School Curriculum but its there is no National Museum of empire in britain or what i was going to touch on that because i think it is a very deliberate a mission you know i love berlin for example and when i get to believe in im so impressed by just the level of just kind of. Openness and honesty that they that the germans confront with the history there is not a st louis you cant go to a museum and learn about the holocaust and you know i would add to that army was forced to reconcile its nestles by the allies having been defeated in the war i think a lot of this stems from britains victory in the 2nd world war but after the 2nd world war britain felt morally victorious rightly having to lead to the nazis and remade itself having been forced to lose its empire remade itself 1 as this benevolent nation on the right side of history and any aspect of our history that was not compatible with that was quietly swear because history is written by the winners and now we are in a situation rice i believe that has created an incredibly dangerous for gelati when i say fragility i mean if you raise fact historically great facts about the empire in the Public Discourse people become hysterical they say you hate britain if you like dont like it here leave yeah and what kind of way is that to respond to historically facts about our recent history and i really think that if we cant understand how weve become this nation the reason we look like this that we occupy the position that we do culturally so much of our culture comes from the imperial period and were totally clueless about it and i think that weve been failed actually by generations of leaders who have continued that in public and theres nothing to see here so i feel very strongly about this and i dont think this is our job as people who have stories that come from colonies in africa or asia i think this is all of our job as british people to stop being curious and honest about this history i do think the whats whats great at the moment is im seeing lots more authors african authors you know i think now theres a demand rather than going on netflix in and just watching something that you know. Is sort of people want to learn like people want to watch documentaries that speak to this stuff so i think in terms of the entertainment world. I personally feel like theres a lot more out there that we can kind of tap into and and learn that i didnt have growing up or at least didnt see as visible as we do now. 21000 was termed the year of return in ghana and for those of us who were part of the guardian diaspora it was such a warm welcome and an exciting prospect the question i wanted to ask you is how do we find balance and practical who culloty in the idea of going back home and building a genu. Ine and practical relationship with the motherland i was so excited to see the groundswell of a Movement Towards gone out of there but i also think part of a person experience its important to have realistic expectations you know if ghana and see me as different thats completely justified ive had a different life but i want to contribute to ghana i want to go on as economy thrive i want see other african countries rise i want to see the continent become unified again to see trade within africa not always extracted to europe and america i want to see some of those colonial borders that divided us through language and National Boundaries become useful trading cultural exchanges as they were before the imperial period so i think its about how can we contribute to that movement and i i am fascinated by the panafrican this period you know those intellectuals who actually created the independence of saw the sovereign african nations who managed to. Colonial era and that philosophy was one of building up the african continent that there could be no future where black people can live anywhere while the african continent is oppressed and still controlled by foreign financial interests so i think thats a project which anyone who cares about this can contribute and its just a question of finding your place in that project i actually went to a panel on that question when i was in the car and it was very much about ok this era time weve had lots of parties you know i think 1000000 visas were given out like it was a success. But how do we continue this and so one of my friends is on the board of the tourism board and she was talking about beyond return you know the whole idea that actually the diaspora coming back to atlanta have to also have a practical mentality you know just Little Things like going into a restaurant and expecting service that you would get in Central London is not going to be the same you know and just understanding the culturally we have to adjust to as diaspora we have to be patient to is not always about them receiving asked because there is differences so i think people are just more conscious about it and everybodys having a better conversation around how do we as diaspora help but also how do we similar ourselves into a culture that is is becoming selfsufficient is becoming successful. So its really exciting to see i think its a real accent and i had an amazing time ghana too much too much of a good time actually. To what extent can we really produce new knowledge within the system thats already based new knowledge on africa new knowledge on what would be considered the east when so much of what already exist is framed through the white i when our basis is already flawed i think youre right about the bases being floored i sometimes think about for example oxford if you study latin greek its called classics and just the name it legitimizes one history of ancient civilization as superior to other ancient civilisations. We study. Study the Industrial Revolution as completely separate from any history around the Transatlantic Slave Trade these things are kind of conceptually separated and even the language we use in everyday life you know we talk about the emmy people stuff that mean anything its everyone whos not white 4 in together in a big lump so here you go you know theres a name for you all. I am really excited as a cultural creator about the opportunities now to speaking to an audience who get it so im not really speaking to the academy im not speaking to people who arent interested in breaking down those conceptual bars im speaking to people who are hungry for knowledge and who are curious and now you have Global Streaming Services that will reach people in the african continent that might reach africanamericans that mean i dont have to go to the same gatekeepers who will say we did a series on africa last year so the communist thing ill say about africa you know oh if you pitch a series after all we did music we did after music last year so. This is i mean after office point we are we living in such a Creative Time and a lot of us all of us are many journalists in a way but actually theres real amazing people that create so i think were living in the time when we can definitely creates new information and new perceptions to the point. Because this is so many. Forms to do it and whoever wants to see or see it and whoever doesnt well youre losing out and i dont want to let the gatekeepers off the hook but we live in a global capitalist Society Money talks and what were seeing actually is that the platforms that do get it making the money i follow consumers are more i mean the word is work but i feel like people are much more inquisitive about ok well if i buy nike or added us where theyre actually coming from or if i watch this on this broadcast or but that broadcast is linked to that and so i do think people you know as you said are more conscious of the content that were consuming and what we are learning and the and because of that we you know creators have to really be very responsible about like are we pumping out the same narrative is a different narrative and i think thats really exciting because were learning and were feeding ourselves with new information because thats the demand thats whats been demanded so what do you see for the future. Or for me ive just retired. From one story on. Its almost like life starts again for me in a way you know ive just accepted a role sporting director of aston villa Football Club probably so i get to kind of make decisions now and i guess that i was kind of always that player that sort of prodded it Decision Makers that why we doing this and why are we doing that and now i am in it and its kind of scary but exciting at the same time if i saw him you know whats i working on for invigorating projects. Which im really excited by i think it speaks to everything weve been talking about how do you reach people i am im an optimistic person yes i think that most people are decent and want to know and learn and experience new things and so. A good journalist a good writer a good creator fines ways of reaching people and thats a big challenge that im excited to take up ill be looking out for it and every one of her friends same thank you saying. You can really make a record ratio this was something monumentally horrific as slavery i think anger and natural and we connect on our collective anger a lot of the time what it poetry do for you its just raw. Whether in the snowy weather in iran is being dispersed eastwoods is a bit more to come still but mostly wish were seeing snow in mass instead of the border or afghanistan or northern pakistan that is the todays final for that there are few showers to the eastern med catching syria or south and turkey and the shame obvious set up down the gulf which is arthur dusty or dusty in cold wind tehran has got then one more day of unpleasant weather then it improves as should be fine weather body into tuesday or wednesday now this wind generally speaking is persistent for 2 or 3 days and cool things down so the average is a bit better than this is dohas forecast is particularly cool at night it will be felt all things are relative after all now given whats happened recently we might well find showers into djibouti and that northeast monsoon mind induces shower to in mozambique with mostly were talking about proper rain further south at this time of the year and something happens in the arabian sea and that proper raise the seasonal stuff to zambia zimbabwe and mozambique and just telling off as you see in southern madagascar this rain is wanted in there as a beak and in zimbabwe and also in bombay and thats where its going to fall. Frank assessments youve got colleagues on the ground in the canaries what is the situation there is on the doctor and one nurse 40200 people informed opinions how big this Foreign Policy in the early stages of a bi ministration he comes into office with a huge amount of Foreign Policy experience indepth analysis of the days global headlines how will a place like yours live get the vaccine when theres no money at all the rest of rich countries are fighting for inside story on aljazeera as a 2nd wave of covert 19 brings a surge in infections a few months ago there were dozens of cases a day now it reaches 2000 and countries and force new measures to curb contagion this is the 1st step toward the governments aim of mass testing the entire population scientists are on the brink of releasing new vaccines to reduce the spread of the virus will it be enough to bring the Global Health crisis to an end the coronavirus pandemic special coverage. From the aljazeera london to a cost center t. V. Special guest in conversation i dont feel because of colonialism unprompted uninterrupted theres a sense of but im still having some legitimacy in terms of spreading the knowledge and technology pretty. Unique or. Something monumental a horrific past slavery studio unscripted on aljazeera. To day every minute a surge in coronavirus cases in the u. S. Stands california into yet another law. The south korean president brings in the. Military to help step up testing amid warnings constables could soon be overwhelmed. Player watching aljazeera live from doha with me fully back to go also ahead ghanas incumbents leader and his predecessor are facing off in a president ial election thats being called the battle of 2 giant