Bomb test in new mexico on july 16th, 1945. Documents key events leading up to the august 6th, 1945 bombing of hiroshima, japan. The author then describes in detail. Thanks very much. You all hear me i hope. Thank you so much for coming actually the most wonderful evening in this glorious city, which my daughter, over there, has completely fallen in love with. Her first visit here. It is such a lovely evening, it is great that you all come here to listen to Horror Stories about the atomic bomb. I havent really made any notes by this because i really wanted to talk to you about the heart on what this book is and what it means to me and the journey that i have taken over the last really two and a half years since i started the documentary. I was asked to make this documentary back in april 2003 by a friend of mine who has a company in london called line television. I did Everything Possible to resist the offered to make this film. Not because the money was appalling, which it was, but actually because this is a really terrifying difficult and complex and frightening and challenging subject to have to tackle. You are dealing with one of the subtle events in world history, obviously. People knew all the cliches. I used myself about the world changing forever. Nothing ever being the same again and yet actually what happened in my case was the thought buzzed around in my brain and it wouldnt go away and it did not go away and finally, almost reluctantly, i accepted this offer and started to make a film. The film i made really was exactly as was described. It was a 24 hour story. It was a story that starts at 8 15 on the morning of august the 5th, 1945 and ends 24 hours later. 1903 feet above a clinic in the middle of her hiroshima on august a sixth. It took me to several different places and people and became, in a way, almost an obsession, a very dangerous thing for filmmaker but in this instance, i decided after that that this subject was something i could not leave and would write a book about. This is a product of that book now. I will say this, i remember someone in my research, a year ago, i started a journey which took me around the world. It was a journey and very privileged to take courtesy of my publishers. I went to eastern seaboard of the United States. I was in the city, i was in new york, and went across new mexico, spent a lot of time in new mexico and then to San Francisco and then actually, eventually across japan. Finally down to a little tiny island in the western pacific. A little dot in the middle of nowhere, which is where the first atomic missions actually flew. Four in that island a high had a very extraordinary experience. I want to share that with you because in some ways it encapsulates the feelings im trying to put across in this book. It is a very small island and its about the size of manhattan. So much so in fact, it looks a bit like manhattan so much so that the construction battalion to actually built the huge air bases from which those missions and others were flown in 1945 actually made the streets so there was a broadway, 86 three, theres a 112th street. You go down 42nd street, its in the middle of the jungle. Make a left on broadway, keep going on broadway, somewhere near the 105th street you find yourself on a runway where the enola gay took off for its mission to hiroshima. Its the only way you can get to the island is from japan, which is interesting. In the sense what you do is you take off from japan and you fly the 1500 miles to tinian. In fact you land very nearby onside pan. You are flying back over the same featureless c and you pass over a volcanic rock of will jima. You are flying at approximately the same height of those guys would have phone about 4000 feet. It is quite a strange and i mentioned these two or three of them that this was actually the side of the atomic missions that they were going back to. They were shocked because what is actually there today is a casino hotel. It is a place where people go to gamble. This is on an island right about greenwich village, if you think of it that way. In one case, one of the japanese tourists or gamblers that was with me actually wanted to get their money back because it was so distraught at the idea. This is actions that have been lost in history, was actually the site of the first atomic mission. Indeed both missions. I drove up in a sort of jeep northwards to find these runways, which is still there riding in the jungle. This was the biggest base in the world in 1945. It was absolutely massive. Forge huge parallel runways. It was a size of kennedy airport. It was absolutely enormous and also the busiest runway. It is completely empty. Nothing there at all, just jungle and these coral runways. One of which you can just about drive on. The other three are really kind of have succumbed to that incredibly fertile jungle. I then took a walk away from these runways down a little pathway that actually traverse, quite a thick jungle actually, and wound its way towards the coast, about a quarter mile. It is actually frighten with snakes. Im terrified of snakes. God knows what the runway went towards this coast through a little path. I found myself, where hoped i find myself, which is on the site of the actual Assembly Buildings where the bombs, which destroyed hurry shimmer and nagasaki both built to finally assemble. I am standing on the foundations of this building, which i have read about and spoke to so many scientists about. This was, for a few short weeks in the summer of 1945, possibly one of the most secret places on earth. If i had been there 60 years previously, i would have been shot on sight for being in this place, but there was nobody there now. It was just me, birds, the wrestled leaves, on the sound of the sea and nothing else, just me. It was a very strange feeling to be in this place where everybody had gone home 70 years ago for what was actually one of the most Extraordinary Events in history. At that point i realize that i traveled on the footsteps. I had been there where it was developed. I had been at the site where the first atomic bomb was tested in the desert, which i will talk about in a moment. I followed the bomb and the pilots who actually trained to deliver this bomb in this really windy, dusty air based on hundred 20 miles west of salt lake city. A place so remote at the time that all the guys that flew from their headed a. It was actually an extraordinary air base right down the middle in the state line hotel lobby so you can basically sober on one side and get drunk on the other side of the lobby. They all told me about that and then of course i also want to San Francisco and underneath the golden gate bridge, in july, 1945, the uss indianapolis, i ship so many of you are familiar with, sailed with its cargo cargo of uranium in a 300 pound lead line bucket while did on its way to tinian island. From there was taken and delivered and dropped on hiroshima. In a way, went to all these places. I followed in ones footsteps. It gave me a sense of the focus of what my book was about. I was going to take the seminal events and the most important three weeks in history of this project and perhaps one of the most important three weeks in history generally. I was going to try and follow individual stories from policy makers of president s and secretaries of wars and very key figures in the japanese at the time down to people. Scientists, lawmakers, people who i have met interviewing spoken to and obviously the aviators who trained in that windy, dusty, salt lake airfield for so many months before they were shipped out to do their job wish they did so remarkably and terrifyingly well. That became the core of my book. My book moves between all these different people as the clock ticks down towards that final second on august 6th 1945 which we, in some sense, commemorated, that is even the right word this saturday. Now what i would like to do if you do not mind is for it will give you a little flavor of what this is all about and the tone in which it is actually written. Before i do so, i should just stress, it is very important to understand that although i have conceived and written this book in a way that i hope will be engaging to people who might not otherwise touched the subject have been so many books written in so many monographs written about hiroshima that many people do not read about it. Because it is daunting, heavily footnoted, perhaps academic, whatever, but everything that i have written is as far as i can verify it true. I have use my own historian training to to be able to test myself and challenge myself constantly with primary sources, with many, many interviews i have done around the world. The stories that i am telling our real stories. These are not fake stories. In fact, this is one of those extraordinary situations where as they say, you know, the truth is much more extraordinary than fiction, much more, much more in this instance extraordinary and fiction. Let me start a good place to start, which is the test of the first atomic bomb in the new mexico desert. We are on july the 16th, 1945 or the 15 to the 16th, 1945, the worlds first atomic bomb looks like a giant four tons fear. It has wire spreading that out of it and it sits on top of 103 foot tower in the middle of the desert in new mexico. There is a massive electrical storm taking place, one of new mexicos worst ever electrical storms taking place. Here is this bomb sitting in the little shack on top of this tower in the middle of the desert and everyone is panicking about the weather because there are all sorts of concerns of what the weather might due to the bomb. There is also some serious concern that this bomb once dented aided might possibly set fire to the atmosphere. And destroy the planet completely. Nobody knows whats going to happen when in atomic bomb goes off. There are bits taking place, in base camp which is not very far away from this tower. Safe distance away three or four miles away. So when scientists are taking bets, on whether this bomb might destroy the or satin sphere, by setting fire on it, this is a serious mathematical probability. Or this could actually happen. It actually was worked out as a mathematical probability. In the middle of all this, doug oppenheim, and the general, general groves, this being a hard task. Who ran from the Manhattan Project. This guy, and these two guys together, who formed an extraordinary marriage or partnership, decided they decided somehow, the make it up there in sabotage this bomb. So they decided to send a man, who was a physicist who go and who to go and babysit the bomb. And he just basically assent to go and babysit the bomb. So i will just read you, and this is chapter one of the book. Just you know its all about. The story is told me by donald hornet himself. When i sat in his living room, and this is how he told it to me. Sunday july the 15th, 90 pm. Trinity test site, south of sorrow new mexico. Don horn egg, stood up the tower. The wind and rain as well as the storm that had been built up during the day had built up like fury. Flash of lightning, and the desert echoed the growl of thunder. The tower, loomed 103 feet above his head. A network of black braces and girders, like a giant electric island. By now the clouds were racing solo against this guy, he could barely see the top. Which was just as well really. He did not want to think, about what was at the top. He began to climb, and the wet steele slip to his feel his fingers, and the rain stunned his eyes. Making it difficult to see. He wore his safety harness. Run by wrong he pulled himself up the latter. Once or twice he stopped, and you can see the guards below him, looking up like ants on the desert floor. They seemed a long way down. At the top of the tower, a simple core gated to check, rested on a square wooden platform. It was a flimsy cheaply made structure. Not designed to last. It wasnt much bigger than a garden shed. Or nic stepped off the latter beside it took a shapeless crouched inside. There was a 61 60 watt bulb hanging from the roof. There was a metallic gray tinted for ton steel drum. It took up almost every inch of space in the shack. Even by day it wouldve looked ominous. It wouldve looked especially so now with the wind whipping, and the dim bulbs swaying from the ceiling. And the thunder and lightning coming near. Cable sprouted from its side, like got sore arteries. Like it was organic. A growing living autonomous embryo, awaiting the moment of its birth. Perhaps an acknowledgment to its essence, and to its creators had even given it a name. A number of names in fact. They called it the beast. The gadget, the thing, the device, and sometimes they just called it it. The one thing, nobody ever called it was what actually was, the worlds first atomic bomb. Hornig squeeze down beside it. The wind ruffled the cage. In just a few hours, scientists standing in a concrete bunker, south of the tower, would initiate the funnel act, and what was the biggest, and most expensive scientific expense experiment in history. He would press a switch on the panel, and begin a 45 second countdown. At the end of that time, a number of Different Things could happen. The bomb could fail to go off. Or it could detonate, with varying links of explosion. Or it could set fire to the earths atmosphere, in the process destroying a life on the planet. The difficulty, was that nobody knew. So that gives you a little flavor, of the kind of tensions that were building. And i decided to go straight in, i make no apologies for this at all, to go straight into that story, and start with that moment which begins three weeks before the book ends in hiroshima. What is also very important in the story, obviously very important indeed, is the japanese side of it. And when i went to hiroshima, i met a lot of different people in hiroshima, people who were still virus from the bomb. They had many many stories. Some which i narrow down and used in this book. Almost exactly as they were told to me. Through an interpreter ahead with me. And there was one story, that really struck me, and i never forgot. And kept turning around around in my mind and ill tell you what the story was and how i used it. I met a man he must of been in his mid eighties and i met him in his living room in hiroshima and he was somebody who had a very bad le burns face. We are talking about various Different Things we are talking about what hiroshima was like before the war and what it was like in months leading up to what it was like when the bomb was dropped. He told me about the good things in the bad things. He told me about the movies that people went to, you know hit movie in 1945, was a movie called for weddings, and if you look at the newspaper of that time, which i have even the newspaper that was printed on august six 1945, this is before the bomb fell, you can see there are sections for the cinema, called for weddings. There was ads for it. He told me about the grass the people late, he told me about the rumors, the city had not been bombed, it had not been touched, almost compared to every other major japanese city. Many of them had been virtually a brought to the ground. But hiroshima had not, it had not because it was being reserved if i could say that, the air forces word, for an atomic attack. Look but hiroshima began to wonder what was going, on there was a rumor going around, and a number people told me about, which was that actually president trumans mother, was a prisoner in the city, shoes being kept captive, and thats why the city had not been destroyed. In other words it was under personal orders of the president of the United States of america not to vomit, because his mother was in it. And his mother was in missouri, many thousand miles away. And the president s personal orders were, if you like the exact opposite. He told me all these things and we start to talk about the day itself. Then i asked him, a simple enough question i said to remember the night before the bomb . And there was a pause and then he burst into tears. Which was terribly embarrassing for me. I dont want to upset him, and i said it doesnt matter. He said no no no i want to tell you something, i want to tell you something that i have never told anybody before. And i want to tell it to you. He said the night before the ball most dropped, was the happiest night of my life. And then he started to tell the story. And the story that he told, was a love story. About a woman, but he had fallen in love with, he admitted that summer, and he is about 19 years old. She was 19 actually he was 2021. She was on the bridge when they met. And theyd fallen in love, and they spent most time together, and what made it poignant is that, the respective families were not happy with this relationship at all. They disapproved of it. Sort of a romeo and juliet thing. And they insisted, because they and loved each other. Then came the time, when he knew he had to tell or, that he had received his papers to the army. Both of his brothers have been killed in the army, and he knew he was facing death. There was no question about it. The americans were soon going to invade. And he would be. Did he would be a statistic. So that night, he and the squirrel, went to a beautiful garden, its a garden still there to today. It was restored after the bomb. A beautiful japanese garden, and they went into the garden, at night the two of them together. They lay on the grass, under the stars, his words not mine, and they lay for the longest time together. And then for the very first time, they held hands and they didnt kiss, they just held hands. And they like that for a long time. Around midnight, departed at the gate, and he went one way and she went the other way. And the next day, the almost dropped. And he searched for his lover, in the ruins of the city. About the time, that they parted at that garden gate, the crew of the noaa gay, would have been just sitting down to breakfast, of pineapple fritters, thats what they had for breakfast before being shipped out to enola gay to head out to it and bomb the city. So what i decide to do in this book, was a way to start and finish the book with that low story, for Different Reasons but also because it moved me deeply, and interesting way to start a book on hiroshima, is to start with these two people in that garden on that night, and that somebody or some people might be able to identify with. So if i can just read you, what i call a preference to the book. This is not chapter one, which i just read parts of. This is the preface before it. Sunday august the 5th 1945 for the rest of his life he would never forget how beautiful the garden look that night. The trees, the lake, the little rainbow bridge, the agent would empty houses dotting the banks, the smell of fresh pine, the white hair and sleeping on the iraq, the perfect stillness of it all. Outside, beyond the garden walls, the city slept in the darkness. In the blackout, it was almost possible to believe there was no city of there at all. No houses, no army, no war. As if he and rachel lying together under the stars were the only people alive in the world. That is how he remembered it the night before the bomb. As always, they had to be discreet. The authorities not to mention their own families disapproved of unmarried couples spending frivolous hours in each others company. These were times of self sacrifice and denial. Every day the new paper in hiroshima urge them to work harder, longer and faster to focus all their energy in the single goal victory. Japan was facing its greatest test in history. This was no moment for love. She was beautiful. Soon i remember the first moment he had seen or earlier that summer by the river. She was sitting on a bridge with a party of other girls and she was laughing. He was very shy. Perhaps there was something about the shyness that appealed to her. Perhaps she liked him because there was so few healthy young man left in the city. He was 20 and she was younger. Just out of school. Her movements were full of grace and years later you would remember there was something in her voice and her smile that had the breath of summer. They saw each other all through that hot july. Sometimes she sent them letters with the faintest with of sent. A luxury in the times of war. They never kissed, they never even touched until that final night. She had cried when she told him of course it was inevitable. He was young and the war wanted him. Time had run out for both of them. He would be in the army by september only a few short weeks away. They lay on the grass and she cried and that was when the touched hands. He would never forget that. At some point in the evening, there was an air raid alert that still they did not move. There were often alerts these days as the american passed north over the city. They flew high in their silver planes, sometime so high that in daylight all you could see was a brilliant white trail in the blue sky. They always took their bombs elsewhere. A little after midnight, they parted. They said goodbye at the gate, reiko walked away down the street. He watched her go until he disappeared around the corner. She never look back. Then he turned slowly towards his home, the memory of her touch still fresh in his mind. Afterwards, he will remember this as the happiest night of his life he looked up at the sky, the stars were clear and brilliant. Tomorrow was going to be a beautiful day. So that is a little bit of the beginning of the book. If i could, do i have time to just move on to a little bit . What i would like to talk about now is obviously the moment of the bomb impact on the city. This was a really difficult thing to write about for obvious reasons. I mean its a fantastically benign thing to say. Obviously it was a very difficult thing to write about. I am writing from a number this front perspectives. Perspective of the ground, perspective of the plane, perspective of the bond makers, perspectives of the politicians as well. It became almost impossible to write. I would like to very share to of what that feels like. There is a point at which language stumbles when you try to describe this pain and this horror and you literally i mean the expression i used at one point was the adjectives begin to pile up like dead bodies on the street. It sounds very clumsy but what i mean by that there is literally nothing but silence at some point. You cannot describe the sounds without being repetitive or pointless. I found very hard to do after making it difficult to write about. And away made it difficult to write what happened. Holding on to indigent personal experience. Im not talking japanese, im talking about the guys in the plane as well as well because the experiences were fascinating and raw. What im going to do very briefly is just really you too small sections if i may of the moment of impact. The moment im going to read you is literally a very clinical description of what actually happen in the first moments when the bomb was actually dropped. Its not personalized at all, the way the other bits ive read to you have been. Its simply a clinical decision of description i should say of whats happened when the bomb dropped. I will read you a bit about the reaction from the enola gay when the plane was just diving away after having dropped the bomb. Just to give you a bit of background here, were at 31,000 feet over the city, there are three planes up there. One of them has graphical instruments, and the third plane actually is the enola gay which is carrying the bomb. The bomb is dropped over a teashaped bridge. It looks from the air like them fingers from one hand. Its distinctly stands out from 30,000 feet. It bomb tumbles out from the bomb they. It dropped for 44 seconds through the air. And indeed, in tests that were done, for this particular bomb design. The ballistics of the bomb was really poor, it made the terrible terrible sound when it dropped. Scientists i talked to talk about this. And i had not heard about this before. But it shrieked, and way old and shout as it came all the way down. It made a terrible rocket. And, one wonders, if this wouldve been the last sound, that thousands of people heard. And they dont know what it. Was the shriek as it came down at almost the speed of sound towards the ground. The bomb explodes, 1903 feet above the clinic, 200 yards away from this bridge. I follow the bomb down, at the end of the previous chapter, and i leave off at the detonation all read that you know. The impact, was immediate and catastrophic. In the first billions of a second, the temperature reached 60 million degrees centigrade. 10,000 times hotter than the sun surface. The heat almost instantaneity expanding. In as brilliant flush flight. Afterwards they gave the light a name, peak or lightning. The opening act in a terrifying trauma. For many who survived, it was astonishingly beautiful, a swirling wave of myriad colors, electric greens and blues and reds and golds, they burned into the retina, and seem to last forever. These witnesses, were fortunate because before the flash even ended, thousands of other human beings, were already did. Burned beyond recognition, by the extreme premeal heat. Instantly carbon eyes, into little charts, where they stood or sat, or slept, or walked. Literally what was left of hiroshima streets. Within a one kilometer radius, the thermal energy contained in that single moment flush, was intense enough to evaporate internal organs. Literally burning off intestines in seconds. Birds ignited in midair. Trees, clothing, wouldnt buildings, household pets, entire street cars spontaneously combusted. Buildings liquefy like grass like wax. Clocks stopped suddenly. Hands burned into the faces, forever recording the precise moment of that nation. Hundreds of fires, spread up simultaneously across the city. Overwhelming the firebreaks, carefully prepared the time before. Clothing determined, how and where people died. Black absorb the heat, white or lighter colors reflected it. In some cases individuals, were so completely incinerated, that nothing remained but theyre shadows. One man was sitting on the steps outside of a bank, 260 meters from the height of the center, were struck. All that was left of him, was the imprint of his pose, scorched into the stone like a photograph. The heat was visceral, and horrifyingly destructive. As if the sun had suddenly descended to earth. And that happened in the first three seconds. This is 8 15 in the morning. 9 15 is far south crew is concerned. But if i may i will read you finally, have the same event from the air. This is the enola gay and i want to give you a couple of character names. The commander of the mission is paul tillis, hes flying the plane. He still live today age 90. The tail gunner, is a man called bob karen. He died in 1995. But i interviewed many of his people is best friend. He becomes one of the key stories in my book. The enola gay was only armed with a tail turret. They strip the blades out completely, so they be able to carry this bomb. Very heavy bomb. Carol was five five, he fitted into this claustrophobic turret. He carried with him, lucky strikes, cigarettes, but also a photograph of his wife, and his little baby. That were dangling in a photograph, from his oxygen chart. They stayed with him all the way theyre in back, and stayed with a multi flew this mission. He also carried with him a camera, that was given to him at the last moment, by a photographic officer. Just before he boarded the plane. The guy said to him look, you have a ringside few here, i want to take any photographs you can. Dont reset the focus, just press the button and whatever you see, just press the button. He gave discovery camera, and sure enough as the airplane dive to weigh, from the shock wave of the bomb, trying to flee the blast wave. As it rushed towards the airplane, bob karen, picked up his camera, and i will read you what he said. Bob karen, sought first, from his turret at the rear of the plane, he had a ring sorry view, looking back at the city. One minute he was peering through his goggles, barely able to see the sun through the darkness, the next he was blinded by a terrific flash. At that moment, the enola gay was 11 half miles from the bomba. First light filled the plane. Several seconds every part of it was paved, with this radiance. Bits, he experienced a peculiar feeling on his teeth, and lead on his tongues. His feelings were interacting with the radiation. Nobody spoke. Then karen suddenly yelled, over the inter calm, through his goggles he watched in astonishment, as something that look like the ring of a distant planet, detach itself and came hurtling toward some. Freaked say another word, the shockwave had caught up with him. It smashed against the fuselage, tossing him up in the air like a scrap of paper. The voice shouted over the interim, and the plane bucked violently, and they fought to keep it under control. At that point, the enola gay was traveling directly away from the city. Only bob karen in the tail could see it. He removed his goggles, now he was staring through his windscreen in amazement. Pulling up from the ground, was a spectacular and terrifying, mushroom shaped cloud. At least a mile wide. With the fiery blood red core. It was expanding at an astonishing rate. Monstrous angry purple gray turbulence. Beneath it, hiroshima had completely disappeared. Everything down there was burning. Thick black smoke, covered the entire city. Rolling out into the surrounding foothills. And into the valley, like lava spilling from a volcano. He grabbed his camera, and started shooting. The gun sight, got in the way. He asked kibitz to turn the plane five degrees, so you can get to the window to his right. One after the other, he snapped images of the mushroom cloud. Seven in all. Each frozen in a black and white frame. Capturing those first instances of hiroshimas destruction. I can still see it he said years later, that mushroom, and the turbulent mass, it was he said a peep into hell. The copilot, bob lewis, picked up his pencil and turn to his log, my god he wrote, what have we done. If i live for 100 years, i will never quite get these few minutes out of my mind. In fact the, part let foreign copilot, bob lewis who i found effect simply of, and he actually drew throughout the strip. And his previous entry to the mushroom cloud, he said there will be a short intermission while we bomb the target. Then we get this my god what have we done. Its quite chilling to read that. That is the moment when it happened. So that also gives you some sense, of how im dealing with the most difficult part of it all. And the last part of the book is about the impact of that moment, and how it affected those people. Most actively the people who are most actively involved in it. But is really all i want to say from this perspective. And obviously i know, ive gone way over time here. So what i take any questions, from anybody if they have any questions, i will do my best to answer. Ive been told that when people ask questions, if they could go up to the microphone, that would really help. Okay. Im curious as how you see both sides, was their consideration, as to how serious was it, by the u. S. Government, and on the side of the japanese, seemed like the bomb, force the emperor, to deny you know i dont know do you see warm going. Let me just you know i should answer, im actually just before the cruise took off, they were blessed by a priest, the crew they were blessed. And who blessed the mission. And bless the people who are taking the war against our enemies. So some of the guys there, whether youre religious or not, theres intelligence if there is an interesting story about the sky bob lewis, and there is another guy, who was the captain of the great artist, the observer plane, who went to confession that morning, because of security restrictions, he was not able to confess, what he was confessing, so it made for an interesting profession. But on a larger scale, its interesting that you talk about religion, because the target selection committee, i interviewed the last surviving member of the target selection committee. That shows the target of here sheila. And in fact the first target, as you know was going to be kyoto. City of 1 million people, japans you know was the original capital, and the most tourist important Tourist Center in japan. And one pete reason it was not chosen, harry temps in, had visited kyoto twice in the 1920s, and he loved the city, and as a result of his love for the city, and his appreciation of japanese culture, he persuaded the president not to drop the bomb on kyoto. And because he had been a tourist in kyoto in 1926, it was spared. So when they were deciding about a city to bomb, they actually decided at one point, to discuss at one point, the possibility of following the atomic bomb, almost immediately, with a full scale incendiary rate. The idea was to send in the bombers, and send an incendiary s at the point when they were most vulnerable. This was discussed quite seriously and the reason they didnt do it was wasnt because of any scruples or religion, that it was just they were worried it would muddy the effects of the bomb. It would make the impact of this new weapon off you know less discernible. The most important thing here was public relation. The pr of the bomb, was important as important as the actual bomb itself. The fact that this was a new weapon and could stop the japanese into surrender. That was key. So youre talking about a cynical destruction, that is a long way from any kind of christian ethic i can understand. But i can understand perhaps the idea at the time why that decision was taken. Even if there was just the slightest possibility, of the Earth Atmosphere catching on fire, and destroying all life on the planet, the u. S. Government would take that chance and test the bomb . Was it because the scientists thought they could feel safe with the idea that if it did happen, there would no be no public bad Public Relations after . Why do they do that. Thats the point i make in the book, its true they would to be around to have to justify it. But the mathematical probability of that happen happening was not huge. It was also the temperature, was that temperature hot enough, to set fire to the or sadness fear. And they actually khaki laid the possibility, there was only slight they calculated the possibility. But the impetus to get this tested and going, it was important to understand the rollercoaster of what the Manhattan Project had become by this time. Were talking about a project that cost over two billion dollars. And killed well over 100,000 people. The entire silver deposits, of the United States pressure a, had been melted down, to get uranium processing plants working. So for some got to say you know theres a slight possibility, we may destroy the planet not life as we know, it lets not do it. You know it just wasnt real. In the same way as when people turn around and say why did truman make this decision, to drop the bomb. Truman himself said it was no great decision. It was not a decision. This is his words. And the reason he said that is because, its terribly callous to us today but, can you imagine a situation which truman, sent in the boys, into japan. Then he turned around to his taxpayers, and said you know what guys, i have a bomb that you guys have paid for, cost two billion dollars, but i decide not to use it, and it couldve ended the war, and your sons needed not have died. So its not real, its not think about, its not how it works. Because we all know today it doesnt work like that. So its a rollercoaster, and there is no way these guys can say that we have had second thoughts were not gonna go ahead with this. I think they were just as worried that it was going to be a dud. And general grows, this large tough guy, who ran the Manhattan Project. He was a chuckaholic actually. His job was to talk up chocolate bars in his safe, as well as top secret files of the atomic bomb. He said if this thing does not work, he said they will stick me in a dungeon so deep in for 11 worth, that they will have to pump sunlight in. Thats for 11 worth. Okay fine. Thanks on what channels it did the government in tokyo, became aware of the devastation, and how long did state clean it up. Great question, again its part of the story in my book, its very dramatic story, and within a note there was actually no sirens that went out when the bomb is dropped. There were warnings coming in, as lawyers were approaching. But it was too late to stop the sirens. There was an announcer, at the Radio Station, who actually began to get the words out, over the radio and what usually happens and it is air raid alert starts up. That at that moment the radio goes off air. And it literally the entire Radio Station tilted on its side. At that point they noticed that he or she may have gone off the air. 40 minutes later the signals people, that they noticed there was a signal break in the line, just north of hiroshima. You can get through the city. Two hours after that, there was a reporter for the news agency, who had been in the center of the city, just before the bomb had gone off, and on to visit a friend of his, and he was actually waiting for a spare pajamas to dry, but he didnt get back to his home in central city where he would been killed. He is back in afterwards, he was supporter. He sends one of the famous news flashes of alltime. He managed to get to a telephone, and he managed to get the news out to tokyo. He says in his news flash. Citizen a huge bomb. At least 80,000 people are dead. And the guy doug and theres an amazing story that he describes in japan, that his boss on the other side, in tokyo does not believe him. He was simply refusing to believe this could happen. And he actually refuses to broadcast this or have anything to do with it all. That went to the six clock news in japan, that there was something heard about some bombs being dropped, and there was some damage, but by later that evening, it was becoming obvious something horrific has happened to the city. And at that point, the news basically, and the president of the United States made a statement that said add that and atomic bomb was lie down on here sheila. Hiroshima. That news was quickly paused pass to the prime minister, and something horrific had happened. As part of the statement that the president made, they said the japanese if they do not surrender, they will face ruin of a like thats never been seen on the serve before. Hello mister walker. Hi. Ive lived in japan, and two questions i would like to ask, quickly the relationship between oppenheim are, and the world know me he was a Security Risk according to the government, but these two were joined at the hip to create this monster of a bomb. And they both benefited from it, in terms of stature or whatnot. So second question has to do is, this bomb seems historically warped. The history of this period, where the United States is the 50th anniversary of the smithsonian, but its starting to turn into a political football, which got nasty an ugly. And at the same time in japan, after world war ii, they tried to get rid of european colonialism, and the drop the bomb in them. And they forgot about korean trauma and china. So historically, all this country to understand the bomb, and. Yeah let me tell you, i think the relationship between oppenheim aaron grows you know his weight was a secret almost as much as that of the atomic bomb. He was rude to everybody so his secretary grosses secretary new morbidly atomic juan than he did and i think he was scared of her. He was a complete bunker. His deputy called him the greatest son of a gun he ever knew. And this was 1945, and as you know his empire was across the world and he was very tough, but he was the guy that was needed to get this thing working. On the other hand oppenheim or, hes kind of a very thin man, hes a corpse like man, he weighs hundred 60 pounds, at the time of the tests, and he smoked five packs a day by then. He is smoking himself into an early grave. And he died of throat cancer in the sixties. He is a nervous man indeed, and he is a man who believes in an open society. He thinks that society should be able to talk to each other. Growth thinks that he is a security freak, you know not only did he set spies on oppenheim are and tapped his phones, and everything he was such a security fee freak, but even his own family, that lived actually near here in washington, they have absolutely no clue what he was doing every single day of his life. When he went into the office. Running the most expensive, and most important Weapons Program in history. The first time they found out about, it was on the day that the bomb was dropped in hiroshima. And he asked his wife he calder and said did you listen to the radio today, at 11 00. And then the switch on the radio, and they hear that this man thats been living with them for the last three years, going to his office just across from the pentagon, is the man who is responsible, for the whole of this program. And they were saying we were completely fabric lasted flabbergasted, when we found out that it was his bomb that was dropped. So unquestionably, this relationships an extraordinary one. Yet its a pivotal. The one key thing about groves, apart from the fact that he terrified everybody, was the fact he was a brilliant judge of character. Yes he was a right wing. And oppenheim or had associations with people who were communists, he was never a member of the communist party but he knew people. But he saw that oppenheim or, was not the most brilliant of scientists. Could not in the nuclear projects. So theyre supersize brilliant eagles, and he was not a noble prize winner, but he saw that he was ambitious, and he recognized by putting him in charge, of all these egg heads as he called them, because he said he couldnt run a faculty meeting, never mind a bomb program. But he realized this guy, would actually keep them all in control. Because he had to prove himself. He was a brilliant talent, but he wasnt a deep thinker. And so it proved, he kept them all in line. That is what gave him his prestige. So i kind of need each other in a way. It was a fantastic relationship. As far as your other point is concerned, the answer is yes. Yes. Its a political football. I will continue to be a political football in time. This question, goes to the survivors of hiroshima. Theyve been living with a second shock wave, and that is a great risk of cancer, and exposure, and they have had to deal with survivor guilt. I wonder if when you talk to survivors, if they talk to you about how they felt about these issues, related to their own survival of this ghastly event. The issue, of radiation sickness is a profound and complex one. It is interesting, for my reading of the archives and i spent some time in the National Archives in washington and obviously interview some key people in the project for still live. This is what is extraordinary about the privilege of had, im dealing with something which is not really history, but its a twilight or a memory of history. Which is why i think its important to write this book. One of the things that is very clear is that they were not expecting, generally not expecting the radioactivity of the bomb to be a key killer. They were generally expecting, the heat of the bomb and the blast waves the shockwave. They were expecting at to be the principal killers effectively. Not so much the radioactivity. But indeed, the memorandum from oppenheim or, which describe how he sets, in very very specific test, they set the detonation high, of the bomb at about 850 feet, and that was designed to be the most effective detonation height, the most demolition of structures. Theyre not talking about you know they felt the higher you go, you know the less radioactivity. The higher the less radioactivity and lower down the more. And they were looking at other things that. Point there was insult insight sorry to the mentality at the time. So the flash though was so extraordinary that theres a very famous story about a blind world who is on her way to a music lesson, and she was being driven by her brother brotherinlaw joe, and he was it was obviously still nighttime when the bomb went off. She was 50 miles away. And she grasped her brother in laws arm and said, what is that light. So this is a bomb so bright, it could make a blind girl see it. Seeing light. So talk about an incredible flash. So immediately after, many prominent figures in that program. They wrote too often hire and to groves and they suggested that they could exploit this blindness, from this bomb. The super powerful sirens, at the same time they dropped the bomb. So people here it and look at that precise moment, when the bombs flash occurs, thus blinding them. Even if they dont kill them. This was suggested, in the memo very clearly about a week or two afterwards. They are not looking at radioactivity, theyre looking at other things. But of course people did die of radioactivity, and you asked about survivors. Well there is one story, that hugely affected me. On the doctor a doctor who told me his story, in osaka i think it was and he was a remarkable man who is in a village six kilometers to the north of hiroshima. He was taken care of a little sixyearold girl. And he was giving her needle when the shockwave struck. He had a grandstand view of it. And the extraordinary thing is, he tells the story which really stuck in my mind. Where he grabbed a bicycle, and he started to cycle down this long white dusty road, towards the mushroom plant in the city. He turned a corner and actually, he was going so fast at that point he fell off his bike and it skidded. And as he picked himself up, and wipe the dust off his clothes, he saw this object coming towards him. Thats how he describes it, this object coming toward some. The object, had huge bulging eyes, like golf balls. And massive gaping mouth, like it was greening. And it was strips of what he thought was closing, i say it because he didnt know it was a man or woman or human being. Well he thought of first might be closing, but then he realized it was burned flesh and this thing was staggering toward him, and he is so qualified he backed away and as he backed way he collapsed, and then convulsed. That appeared to die and he went towards this thing, this monster. And he said i have to do something, but he didnt know where to touch the flush at all. So he hesitantly no one tell you this is quite extraordinary he touched the flesh the burned black and flesh on this thing then hes done up he said a prayer and stood up to continue his journey. And his he looked down, this white road, he suddenly saw, hundreds if not thousands, of the same figures, coming up the hill toward him all with their arms outstretched, and all coming towards and literally became thousands of them. He said and i quoted him, he said my god, how many of them are there. Are they all coming up the hill . So he tried to treat them, it is little hospital they only had some soybean oil and some rags. And he would go out amongst these people, thousand lying lying in the fields, with the torch, and make a decision about which ones to treat, and you know the ones he was treating was following him with their eyes but he cannot do anything about it all. There is one story about a naked girl who is rushing, she was rushing against among these bodies. And theyre trying to get her to fall to cover up her legs. Her legs were naked and white and touch. He describes that detail in the book. And how other people around were trying to cover her up, give her some sense of modesty in that moment. And she was playing her clothes away. And then of course what started to happen, is that people started getting dysentery, and then other things happen. So that came later, and it continued, and as some historians say, there were 30,000 people that died after, and compared to what who died right beginning. And many live with the effects of it from today till today. Is it possible, that u. S. Scientists didnt know there be radiation. We did know there would be radiation absolutely. Did they thought they would wipe out most of the populations that wouldnt be lover. Yes yes in fact that was one of the things they were doing with the test, they were followed monitors, right through the state of new mexico and beyond, when they were testing at night. So they had chosen names from the wizard of oz, like the tin woodsman, and then their role was basically evacuee entire populations at night, so there might have been just americans might have to be to leave. But the cloud actually went around the world five times before dissipated. From the new mexico test. So when did churchill and a stall and find out about that was it in potsdam . Where we key japanese fighters in the fighting planes when it was. Drop well on the first question, truman did actually you know they did know about the bomb project. In fact when he was told, by the secretary and read general groves account, he said what does electricity what is it meaningless, what is gun powereds nothing. This atomic bomb, is the second coming. Its a great churchill phrase. So churchill knew stolen, was not supposed to know about the bomb. Key in a very very carefully staged managed event, one evening after one of the sessions, truman casually, wandered over to stolen and told stalin that they had a weapon, of unusual destructive power. They were intending to use on the japanese. Churchill was watching every moment. They were to live together like schoolboys. And stalin said thats great, do use it and said nothing more. And stalin or, actually churchill was convinced they got a hit got away with it, and that stalin knew nothing about it. They were pleased with the law. But in fact stolen new everything, because he had spies. And he had spies who are at the trinity test. If youre sitting back information at the time. And it was a recorded conversation, that took place between molotov, and stalin. Were stolen turns to molotov, and says we have to get on to this, and start getting this moving. We have to get kercher talk of on it. And kurt you talk of, was an oppenheim or a basically a russian oppenheim or. And the fighters there were no fighter planes, and Nothing Happened there was no flak, there was nothing really. One of the reasons why that happened, is because japanese number of practice missions guys have flown, the which are very very big bombs, they were conventional bombs. They would deliberately fly these missions, with one or two or three airplanes, and they were doing it with the express and specific purpose, of the japanese getting used to high flying airplanes, that did no damage. And he says to six pressley that it worked, and they flew these missions, and whats one or two or three planes headed to, they are not dangerous. Maybe a Reconnaissance Mission so they werent touch. Tidbits said after the war, that in the hiroshima mission, was the most boring mission he had ever flown. Which in a way is a terrifying advertisement for my book, but astonishingly revealing, about how perfect that mission was. It was the perfect mission. Last one im sorry yes last question. First of all, i would like to say that today is the last day, for me to be japanese, tomorrow i will be a u. S. Citizen. After living here for 33 years. I decided to become a u. S. Citizen. And i will swear in tomorrow. And i thought i had known, about this as a japanese. But im looking forward to reading your book, and getting more detail. But two basic questions, number one, is that when this Manhattan Project, was conceived, has this been specifically designed to bomb japan . It has america ever thought about dropping this bomb on germany in the war . Thats number one and number two question, you say somebody they like kyoto so much, but why hiroshima, why not tokyo, why not any other place . Okay to take each questions roughly and separately, okay im going to tell you a bit of a story, the scientists a hungarian scientist, fled berlin in 1933. He was working at the physics physics department. He was a nuclear physicist. He came to london, and he was standing on a street corner, in a part of london, and he was staring at the traffic light, and in the moment that the traffic light changed, this is his words not mine, from red to green. He suddenly saw how an atom bomb woodwork. He saw what we now call the chain reaction. He saw how good work in that instant. And and abyss opened up in front of him. He came from nazi germany, and he thought if i thought this, there may be german scientists in berlin, that has the exact same inspiration. On some other traffic light junction. So it so terrified him, that he campaigned to get the atomic bomb built by the americans or british, to get ahead. And stop them doing the exact same thing. And so he went to his teacher, einstein, and together they drafted a letter to roosevelt at the time, which they urged the president to construct a atomic bomb. And they opened a bottle of napoleon brandy, and he said this requires action. And that became what we called the Manhattan Project. Its fundamental purpose, was to make sure that americans had an answer, to a german atomic bomb. Not a japanese one. When he was a clear by 1944, 90 45, that the germans did not have an atomic bomb. And also that they were way behind royal the u. S. The next obvious place with japan. They turned against the very program, that he had been so hard campaigning for. Because you could see the point of it all. What an earth are we developing this weapon for. Its such a terror, for future generations. When actually the japanese are not an atomic threat. He even petitioned the president at one point to not develop this, just before it was dropped on hiroshima. And it was signed by 69 scientists at the university of chicago. And general groves stuck the position the petition in his drawer, and it never got to president truman. He never sought. So youre absolutely right, it wasnt japan, and very briefly on the issue of hiroshima, as a chosen target, why it was number two, so hiroshima gratified a large area the target, was a perfect target. He was untouched by bombs virtually. All of these other cities have been pulverized, and it could show the effects of the bomb very clearly. It had one major advantage, it was surrounded on three sides by mountains. And very expressly, the number of the people of that target selection me committee, its it how the mountains created a focusing effect, that would increase the blast from the bomb. It was untouched, its geography was bomb perfect, and the weather pattern turns look good, and they check the weather for the last hundred and 50 years. They checked it in order to see when the best bomb days would be. And if it that two or three possible days. So it was in some sense, also japanese you know there were a lot though that werent in the army. And the president made a statement, made a statement to the world that he dropped this bomb the president made that. And ive seen various drafts of that, and earlier drafts of the statement, he just says 16 hours ago a bomb was dropped on black, city to be provided so was blank. When hiroshima was put in, there was serious debates and took place with the secretary of war and long island, and they decided to add the phrase, important Japanese Army base. That was only added hours before the president broadcast that to the world. That was not the initial drafts of the of this. So it was important to justify with basically worldwide justification. So i hope that answers your question. Thank you applause