clandestine service and just associated with the torture program. she was running it. she was one of the architects of the torture program. and i have to say this, from my own experience, debriefing detainees in iraq, the torture program was not only, i think, useless, but it was counterproductive. and actually created more enemies for us to have to go after. >> she hasn't sat for a confirmation, so we haven't gotten her updated opinions on any of these things, but she does have the past that you are referring to. and donald trump said say on the campaign trail that he thought waterboarding should come back. he would bring it back and he would want to do worse. because what isis is doing isn't fair and we shouldn't be playing by any sort of rules. we shouldn't be constrained. he got large cheers for this. do you think this is an indication that maybe we're going back in that direction of enhanced interrogation, of waterboarding, of torturing our detainees? >> i certainly would hope not.