everything that was on his mind. >> had, michael steele, a way of being in the center of all of the biggest debates of our time. >> he loved quoting teddy roosevelt talking about the man in the arena face marred in dust and grime. he wanted to be in immigration, health care, confounding campaign finance reform where i would argue he won the battle and lost the war and left us with a worse campaign finance system than we had, and probably helped to eviscerate the power of the major political parties which led in some ways to the rise of donald trump. he wasn't right every time and we should remember that. >> of course. >> at the same time, he always wanted to be at the center of the action and in that fight. >> and he was. nicolle wallace, john mccain was sort of the opposite of the kind of candidate that -- in your former life campaign consultant, very often the advice is to be very careful. poll test your lines. don't say the wrong thing, don't go off script. that was not john mccain. >> that wasn't john mccain, but