Transcripts For DW The 20240703

Police presence. Thats up to the colleges and universities. As for them to decide, they tell us were going to come tonight. Were gonna come today. Were gonna come tomorrow. Theyre just tiring us out. East. Were open scare tactics. Re nothing compared to the desk of over 34000. 00 power. Steering is also coming up the u ins. Top Court Refuses to order germany to stop exporting weapons to is real welcome to base our arguments and their role as opposed to funds cleared. Majority votes to one, no reason for provisional measures, which ill review is watching on cbs in the United States and to all of you around the world. Welcome. We begin today with protesters and police in the United States on campuses, across the country. Police have begun arresting people connected to pro palestinian protests more than 1100 people have been detained since the 1st campus demonstration of that was 2 weeks ago at Columbia University in new york city. And that is where the situation escalated on tuesday. Pro palestinian demonstrators barricaded hamilton hall, a building well known for being occupied during demonstrations against the vietnam war. In the 1960s were today Columbia University said that it will expel students who have occupied the building. The president believes it, fortunately, taken over a building on campus uh is absolutely the wrong approach. That is not an example of peaceful protests. And of course, as we write a note, a page speech and hate symbols also have no place in this country. A small percentage of students shouldnt be able to disrupt. Yeah, demick experience this, the legitimate study for the rest of the student body. Im not aware of any evidence of either a intelligence world or a Law Enforcement about about a half years. This is not protected free speech. What this is doing is violating the rights of others, jewish students who are merely on campus trying to get an education who are playing by the rules. They kept their impeded from going to class. Theyre impeded, theyre told not to come onto the University Campus where they are paying tuition and they have valid id cards to be when you, when you cross the that rubicon. And you begin to threaten the lives and intimidate and harass people to the point where they can not engage in their freedom. Then that is unlawful or ever more on the pro just im joined now by ethan berman. Hes an adjunct professor of legal law school in los angeles. He also hosted his own radio talk show of focusing on current events, especially in the United States. Thats where we got to know ethan ethan. Its good to have you back on the program. Talk to me, if you would about the student protest situation in california where you are. Well, it is widespread. Its a u. C l, a u s. C. Its in San Francisco at berkeley. Its out a campus called you see humbled. Theyve been relatively intense. You c, l a has kind of breed breached into a minority of the prep. Protesters there who have are not just protesting the war in israel and gaza, but have gone after jewish students as well, which is become problematic. And i will be very curious to see how the department of education approaches what the university is to receive federal funding will do in the future. I want to talk about that in just a moment. Let me ask you, 1st of the, how do you explain the genesis of the student protests . I mean, it was only 2 weeks ago when the 1st protest began on the campus of Columbia University in new york city. Hasnt been that long or well, theres conflicting reports about the genesis whether or not at a very clearly for many decades are a strong anti war sentiments on College Campuses. Particularly here in the state of california. They really grew out of the 19 sixtys up at berkeley in San Francisco bay area. And so that has always been here, but there has been some speculation. And i dont know if theres any, anything founded in it, but that there might be outside influences that are helping to organize some of these protests or some of the non students who are coming onto campuses that are maybe not just straight anti war protesters, but they have definitely drown and they are causing their own set of issues because the 1st amendment is not in on limited amendment. There are limits and especially on private property. There are definitely limits to what pro gestures can do. And you bring up a good point that a lot of the people that weve seen on College Campuses, they, they may not be students of people. All the people that weve seen protesting, we assume most of them are then in mind, Columbia University. It has one of the largest jewish student populations of any College University in the us. And this is where calls to divest from israel, seem to have found the loudest voice. Does that surprise you . It it doesnt necessarily surprise me. I think its a, its deeply disturbing though. However, when you bring up that specific point about the jewish population, Columbia University used to have a jewish quota all the way into the 1960. So were talking about civil rights in the United States. It wasnt just uh, the black population that was red lines in the United States. It was also the jewish population. And so the Civil Rights Movement was actually a combination led by black leaders like reverend Martin Luther king junior. But jewish leaders were a key part of the Civil Rights Movement. Sort of see this happening at columbia, and in particular, right, i havent heard anybody else point this out yet. Alexander hamilton was the most pro jewish founding father of the United States. And thats the whole that they happen to have taken over. And columbia is hamilton home. Yeah, that, that hall was also, im a, a focal point for a student protest during the vietnam moore as well at Columbia University. And you and i have talked about this before, you are jewish, and when you look at whats happening right now, there are claims of anti semitism. I mean there are chance that were hearing that we cant repeat on the air here that are considered anti semitic. Here in germany, and this is happening on College Campuses in america, where people traditionally have expected you to find a hot bed of liberal thinking. How does this happen as well that that is something that shows you all or just will want to spend some time dissecting in the future as we look back at what is happening today. But for too many jewish people in the United States, it does feel reminiscent of the early 1930 is the breaking of windows at hamilton hall, the trapping of, of jewish students. So they cannot enter buildings. This is deeply resonance with the many jews in the United States. It is very upsetting to manage use. So while the majority of protesters i believe are acting in good faith and what they believe to be an anti war stance, there definitely is a percentage whether their students are outside agitators that are bringing in a strong anti jewish sentiment. Maybe if you could explain from an American Point of view ethan American Jewish point of view, we have seen your students at columbia interviewed who are part of the protests, who say that they are protesting. And that they are in time. Zion is saying that you can be an anti zionist and not be anti semitic. Does that compute with you, you know, and any time you can always find an example of an isolated the individual who does not represent the group. The jews are zionists almost the, the, almost the total majority is greater than 95 percent as high as 99 percent in various polls. Its a core to our belief system. So when i hear the term anti zionist, jude, thats anesthetic goal. We just had passover pace off at the said or would show is a reminder of the x it is we talk about returning to jerusalem. This is from thousands of years ago. So when i hear anti zionist you, that might be what they believe, but its not a core jewish belief in any way, shape or form even barren, giving us valuable insights and what is happening across the United States on College Campuses at the moment eastern. Thank you. Thank so much frank. Israels Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says that his countrys army will enter the southern gauze of city of bravo with or without a ceasefire deal with moss. Im speaking at a meeting with the families if is really hostages. Netanyahu said that is real well not in the world until all of its goals have been achieved. That includes eliminating her boss battalions in rougher or more on this. I want to bring in journalist sammy circle. He is standing by forrest in jerusalem. Seem to get to see you. We know that how boss is considering and his really truce proposal at this very hour reportedly. So why is Benjamin Netanyahu . Why is he talking about a rough invasion now to the neo as being the talking about the flushing vision for quite a long time now must tell you that the large part of these really public does not believe that hes actually intending on the, going into uh, rough uh, you know, a, they would say that, you know, if you want to show, show, dont pull. And they say that the video has just been talking about. And hes been trying maybe to pressure how miles maybe hes trying to give the illusion to these riley public that hes doing something in gaza, maybe is or early is believe the, the more in gaza is actually ended. And they dont to hear much about the Ongoing Campaign in gaza, but they do know that many of the troops have withdrawn from the gaza strip. So the prescription is ready is that maybe in january already the war basically has finished. And the yellow is just a, giving out these empty yes, threats, continuous. What that means is interesting that you, you say that because we, we are hearing that the relatives of the hostages. They say that they are encouraged by a possible incursion into bravo. We, we hear that members of the board cabinet definitely want this military operation to happen to the fact that its perceived that this is a lot of talk in the wall. Does that have to do with the pressure from allies such as the United States, secretary of state entity blinking, hes in israel right now and we know what the, his stance is on rough. So sure, for sure. The american prussia is a, im an actor here and the, these riley public is now realizing that its not so easy for his road to go in to offer. Its taking a long time and we are read the field and weve seen it in the public opinion. Polls that was published a today by these really public television, and then theres a shift, spindly is rarely public. The public doesnt believe that this really is going for a victory in the gaza strip. Mean the 65 percent, but im reading your dont believe nothing. You know, uh then when he says that were close to the victory in the gaza strip. So theres a lot of distrust here towards it then. Yeah. Oh. So were doing things move from here. Then. Sammy, i mean, oh, we dont have resolution to the situation in gaza. There is really no plan for after gaza. So what, what does this rarely public expect to happen next . So surprisingly again, in the, in the phone that was published today, we see that the majority of the public there are now interested in having a did with how im us in having a. Ready asian or swap in releasing the hostages in releasing palestinian prisoners. And we even see that theres a growing number of those who support and l to this more because the believe here is that its going nowhere. The nathan yahoo is the only thing that is a interesting him at this stage is hes political, the survivor. And the now is called within his own government between 2 cops. As there is a one time headed by a mob, been the and a smoker. Each of these to represent the, the far right. And theyre saying that if israel was not going to offer, they would leave the government. And all the other hand you have guns and others where saying that if they wont be a deal, then they will leave the government. And then you cannot. Ready try yeah, well the next 24 hours, it could be crucial if and when we hear a yes from us concerning a ceasefire offer, we will see sammy tucker with the latest in jerusalem tonight. Same you as always. Thank you. The you ins top court has rejected the request by nicaragua to order germany, to stop sending weapons and other military aid to israel. The International Court of justice in the hague rule, that legal conditions for making that kind of order simply have not been met. Some sense the her uncle argues that by supplying weapons is real. Germany is facilitating genocide and gauze. During the hearings, the German Government said that it has fairly ex forwarded weapons to israel. And since the offensive started following the october 7th, the terror attacks, by whom ox we look at what has its all right for us and legal analysis now enjoyed by some jeffrey nice. He worked at the International Criminal tribunal for the former yugoslavia between 19982006. And he led the prosecution of slipping on the legs of which the former president of serbia mister, nice, its good to have you with this again. And i reading this correctly, that the court today said that it looked at the facts and based on the facts at this time, it can not give me a rock or what it one it completely correct. Its a sort of a word. So that sort of holding judgment, it certainly doesnt achieve for nicaragua, what it wanted to retrieve. It does look less in way of favoring one side or other of this horrible concrete. It good identify 2 things. First, that nicaragua compress the head with its case against these rail against germany. If it wishes to on the basis that germany may have become involved in the supply of his full use. And what is the number of who walk maybe and all the rules will come conduct of contract, but not at this stage, sufficient evidence to prove a need for protective measures. And it also left without comment. Vulnerability of states, general b to i, c, c and r C J International quarter justice jurisdiction full for example, provision of arms to israel or its going back to the war. Yes, it was a bit of a holy document. I want to pick up on that. It just a moment, but i just want to be clear this case um it continues and does. Does that mean that the court could eventually rule against germany at a later stage is incorrect to his case against germany, which he ledges breaches of the Genocide Convention by germany in respect of its provision of weapons and continue whether that will actually happen, i think, is a matter for future consideration, but it can continue as germany tried to have it taken off the list as a cold spaces and the court refused. Mm hm. Whats the, whats your read on this mister lives . Do you think that this is basically, you know, the end of this case . I dont know whether its the end of this case. And im not sure that i have an overall view, but it leaves states that are supplying weapons to israel in the position that they know they may be pursued of the International Court of justice by any of the statements, a party of the Genocide Convention. If the stage is able to establish the subject stages in the possession of knowledge, knowing it knows that these weapons may be used from the full conduct of war. So thats one part of the read up the other parts of the increase. And theres just quite a helpful thing from germanys point of view, but also from the point of view of the country is its really saying dont jump to susan could be said of net, correct. I the words i believe its being said in respect to alleged reflection by nicaragua or russian interest me, but its going to shoot. Its tried with insufficient evidence role model strongly emotional grounds to bring this case against germany. And well, well have to do is to detach ourselves from the high emotions that can be generated by this awful conflict conductor with the evidence. And i think that perhaps the most valuable element of this josh would ovary and on both sides is to set aside the motion. Look at the evidence is around. Busy for the contract is there is on roll. So contract, whos the, whos the bad responsibility in the court . Isnt the court doing exactly that . They did the court today and its ruling and said that it noted that germany had reduced significantly the amount in value of weapons they didnt have sent to israel since the october last terror attacks me as proof that germany is not trying to arm a country to commit genocide, thats a non emotional observation, correct . Well, i found the old a pretty fin folks when i listen to it. And then when i eventually found it on the website, it was sites navigations besides the history of drum, those provisions of weaponry. Those, its various licenses that are required, the website is provided and the weapons requested to be a ground to their license. I think the submarine and some of the aircraft i think for which, you know, provision their licenses have yet being granted. And to that extent, it certainly seemed to have given a decision based on german whos calling back. But it doesnt say as in terms, its simply sets out the evidence. The judgement is provided and says it logical theres no, theres not enough evidence. And thats why i go back to the original position. I think this is a holding position. I mean, it was quite a tablet thing for the quote to have done. As it goes, it goes, it con, goes a comp reverse. The early decisions made in january brought to as a result of what south africa did. Right. That respects that but it doesnt change the position very much. But the rooms everyone they go to on to the Geneva Convention is that sign doctor. And that Genocide Convention who signed up please. Let me, let me pick up this. Im the case with south africa. Im just reminder of you or self advocates accusing is really perpetuating genocide in the gaza strip. The court has called on is real to do everything in its power to prevent genocide. So does that mean that is real may be found to have committed genocide in gaza . I mean, is that question still to the answer . No, it doesnt im. Its understandable. The short found and that it in the woods of journalist and commentators is that there was a proposal case of genocide established. Know what the quote found was that there was a plausible, by the way the word crucible is not defined. Its a word used by the International Court of justice, not the quotes. It was a plausible case for finding the rights of the goals and people not to suffer genocide where at risk of potentially immediate impairment. Mm hm. So it was very slightly different, but significantly different from a finding of crucible genocide being committed. Thats theres not being com. Okay. And its very important for the listeners and views to understand that us in the way these things advanced slowly. I want to ask you before we run out of time, and mr. Nice that us media reporting that the International Criminal court may issue an arrest warrant for is really Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. We just, we dont have much time here. I just wanna ask, do you think that that will happen it begins to look at the law may be issued. Thats very good news. Not because it is particularly is judy against not in yahoo. I dont express an opinion about that because it shows that the International Code is not going to be in too many today. T in doing its job in respect to lead is great. So supported lots of orgy. So does that extend its good news . Whether its going to be issued or not, i dont know, but its beginning to look as though its quite lucky. And that i think is also good news when measured against what may be said about the International Criminal court. That is being very slow over the last decade, also to conduct investigations, to say things about the state of israel. Okay. Um its been very slow. Oh, okay. And now perhaps its realizing that its reputation is going to be dependent on buying so bad on being seen by the public at large to do its job regardless of who the alleged defender may be. Ok, so jeffrey, nice as always, mr. Nice, its good to have you with us. We appreciate your analysis tonight. Thank you. Youre most welcome of the day is almost done. The conversation continues online and we will see you next on the looking for the french business. Gathered above and beyond the use its safe to submit a lifetime call 0. Be a trip to africa with the 77 percent on w. I let me think, i got stuck on a piece of bicycle on it. I guess somebody who knew, but i just got out of the millions of people around the world cant attend school even though the un defines the human rights education for everyone. 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